Roberto Alomar- sad story if it's true...

[kingjammy24]

Re: Roberto Alomar- sad story if it's true...

I know there's a lot to be said about maintaining one's composure......and Hirshbeck get's the prize, because if I was that umpire, and that piece of garbage has said that to ME..

you've completely lost the plot. do you understand what went down?

1) alomar struck out. he disagreed with the call. so far no problems.
2) hirschbeck unleashed a completely unacceptable slur. oh oh, problems.
3) alomar spat.

do you see how #2 came before #3? you seem to think alomar made the comment about hirschbeck's kid before hirschbeck slandered him. he didn't. alomar hadn't said a word about hirschbeck's kid until way after hirschbeck had already become abusive. before alomar even said a word about the kid, hirschbeck had already lost it. hirschbeck uttered a disgusting slur simply because alomar argued a call. so yes, hirschbeck got the least of it. secondly, you seem to think alomar taunted or made fun of the kid. he didn't. he simply said he thought hirschbeck was stressed out from his kid's medical situation. seems like a pretty obvious conclusion to me. anyway, i enjoyed your analysis of alomar's medical condition right down to when he contracted it and when it began manifesting itself. right up there with your analysis of the alomar/hirschbeck incident which you made without a clue as to what hirschbeck even said or how it all went down. excellent!

rudy.

[ChrisCavalier]

Re: Roberto Alomar- sad story if it's true...

Hey Everyone. I have been having a problem with my laptop so haven't been accessing the site as frequently as usual. I just had the chance to read through this thread and noticed a few posts that appeared to be getting a bit heated. While everyone is certainly entitled to their opinions, please make sure all posts are consistent with the forum rules. Among other things, please note the following:

No Personal Attacks. Do not harass, belittle, threaten or “flame” another member. Do not call other members names, even in jest. You may dispute opinions and facts, but do so with facts and not by taking it to a personal level. This forum is intended to operate in a positive environment. Please help us achieve that goal.

Thank you in advance for your compliance.

[bigtime59]

Re: Roberto Alomar- sad story if it's true...

IIRC, back in the day it was said that Hirschbeck had hit the Latin No-No Button twice (and contradicted himself, besides) calling Alomar a mother fornicating British slang for cigarette.Alomar walked away without saying a word a little over a year later when Hirschbeck called him out on a pitch off the plate to end the 1997 ALCS.

[BaseballGM]

Re: Roberto Alomar- sad story if it's true...

Wow.....rudy's right up there with Mr.3000 in "eloquence of posting".

Hirschbeck got "the least of it"???

WHAT, rudy, POSSIBLE racial slur could be WORSE than going after the parent, FACE TO FACE, of a dead child?

PLEASE......I'm all ears.....

I don't give ONE CRAPOLA what Hirschbeck said to Alomar......Going after someone who lost a child and stating that to his FACE is grounds for instant death in my book.

I know there's a lot to be said about maintaining one's composure......and Hirshbeck get's the prize, because if I was that umpire, and that piece of garbage has said that to ME, no matter WHAT NAME I had called him......there would have been one ugly scene of ALL-TIME in sports history in regards to a fight on the field. There is NO excuse for going after a parents DEAD CHILD. It would have taken about 9 grown men to remove my clamped hands from his dead crushed throat.


But that's just me.

Just to clarify, Roberto said out loud to a reporter after the game what other players had said previously about Hirschbeck in lockerrooms - that he had become bitter since the death of his son. Inappropriate? maybe but even Jose Canseco (who seems to be credible these days) wrote in his book that there was much more to the Alomar/Hirschbeck story than people realized. Hirschbeck was the aggressor during that argument. Robbie made a poor emotional decision and spat. But, they both gained their composure and eventually became friends.

[kingjammy24]

Re: Roberto Alomar- sad story if it's true...

apparently, alomar had been questioning hirschbeck's calls throughout that game. big deal. hirschbeck then ejects alomar. alomar comes flying out of the dugout and at that point it turns into a he-said/she-said with alomar saying he spat after hirschbeck let loose with the derogatory terms and hirschbeck saying he let loose after alomar spat.

alomar's words about hirschbeck's kid came after the game and hirschbeck didn't even learn about them until the next day. secondly, they weren't even about his kid. here are his infamous words:

''I used to respect him a lot. He had a problem with his family when his son died -- I know that's something real tough in life -- but after that he just changed, personality-wise. He just got real bitter"

wow. what vitriol. real vulgar stuff there. alomar never "went after hirschbeck's kid" like some here seem to think; the implication that alomar was taunting or mocking. the biggest insult in there is alomar calling hirschbeck "bitter". compare those words to what hirschbeck was said to first have called alomar which i hear ranged from f*ggot to motherf*cker to spic and something thrown in about alomar's mother. alomar gets called those names and hirschbeck gets called "bitter". so yeah, hirschbeck got the least of it. the kicker? alomar got a 5 day suspension and hirschbeck got nothing because apparently umpires can say absolutely anything to a player with complete impunity. hirschbeck wasn't even fined. again, he got the least of it.

what's really amusing is how this nothing incident is still remembered so vividly to this day, in an age when you've got one of the biggest players in baseball history admitting he defrauded baseball for 3 consecutive years. i can only imagine what ty cobb did to umpires. if the worst thing alomar did was spit at an umpire who insulted his mother or be bisexual, then he's a saint in a sport with the likes of barry bonds, clemens, a-fraud, canseco, darryl strawberry, and a host of other genuine miscreants.

it's my personal opinion that a $15 million lawsuit launched 3 years after the fact, on the sole basis that his girlfriend developed "AIDS phobia" seems like little more than a shakedown. she didn't contract anything from him but still feels like suing anyway? she's claiming "permanent emotional distress" (apparently from the shock of testing negative) and needs $15 mill to recover.

rudy.

[kingjammy24]

Re: Roberto Alomar- sad story if it's true...

according to the story, his gf found out that he tested positive in feb 2006. at that point she suffered "extreme distress". oddly enough, she remained his girlfriend until 2008. apparently she didn't feel like suing until after they broke up.

rudy.

[emann]

Re: Roberto Alomar- sad story if it's true...

Alomar issued a statement to ESPN, take it as you will. As I commented before it's a pretty sad story...

"This is a very private, personal matter and I greatly appreciate all the support I have received in the past few days from my family, friends and colleagues in baseball," the former All-Star second baseman said in a statement. "I am in very good health and I ask that you respect my privacy during this time."

[kingjammy24]

Re: Roberto Alomar- sad story if it's true...

the rest of alomar's statement and the recent espn article:

----------------------------------------------------------------------
"As for the lawsuit, it is filled with lies and I am deeply saddened that someone I cared for would make such terrible accusations and try to hurt me in this way," Alomar said in his statement.

Earlier Wednesday, his father told ESPN that Roberto is not ill.

"The only thing that I can tell you is that this is news to us," Sandy Alomar Sr. said. "When a person is sick like that, wouldn't he have to be in the hospital? I haven't seen my son sick like that. I am confident that he is fine."

"We are a family. We are very close, a family that is united. I am sure my son is fine. Other than that, we are going to let the lawyers handle it." Alomar Sr. said he saw his son on Monday when Roberto ended a visit with the family.

"He was well. He wasn't sick," Alomar Sr. told ESPN.

Alomar was honored before the Toronto Blue Jays home opener in April and showed no obvious signs of health problems.

Alomar lawyer Charles Bach told the New York Daily News the allegations are "frivolous and baseless."
-------------------------------------------------------------------

rudy.

[bigtruck260]

Re: Roberto Alomar- sad story if it's true...

Rudy - I usually agree with most of what you say here...but....

You are really going extreme in defending Robbie. If he has AIDS so be it, but if he in fact did expose his partner to it - bad stuff. I hope he's telling the truth...but I also hoped Clemens was truthful too.

My guess is that there will be a book about it someday, and everything will come to the forefront.

[spartakid]

Re: Roberto Alomar- sad story if it's true...

From reading the article, whether or not he exposed her to it isn't actually the Legal interest. Morally is another story. But, if she did indeed wait two years after this happened, it's obviously a scheme to try and get money. It's really pathetic, and I'm sure the judge will see it this way as well, this isn't something that you wait two years and then try and pursue, conveniently after the two parted ways. Just my realistic and judicial view on the matter, socially and morally, you could look at it another way.

[kingjammy24]

Re: Roberto Alomar- sad story if it's true...

You are really going extreme in defending Robbie. If he has AIDS so be it, but if he in fact did expose his partner to it - bad stuff.

what extremes? i'm just pointing out some of the very odd loopholes in the lawsuit. you think it's extreme to say it's bizarre that a woman files a suit, 3 years after not contracting HIV, for $15 mill? she knew in 2006 yet the "emotional distress" didn't reveal itself until now?

anyway, i agree with you in that if alomar has AIDS then so be it and it's very sad. the thing is, unlike many here, i'm not saying he has it or that he doesn't have it. suicide_squeeze has apparently already seen alomar's medical records and not only determined when he contracted HIV but also when it began manifesting into AIDS. many posters are chiming in saying "oh, very sad" as if it's it's already a fact. all i'm trying to point out, other than the oddities in the lawsuit, is that noone knows either way except for robbie. it's "extreme" for me to say that none of us knows whether robbie actually has AIDS or not?

if alomar does indeed have AIDS, if he knew it, and if he intentionally exposed his partner to it, then obviously it's very bad. at this point, noone knows if he has it, noone knows if he knew it, and noone knows if he intentionally exposed his partner to it. despite that lack of knowledge, there seem to many posters practically asking where to send their condolensces. yet i'm extreme? as for the hirschbeck vs alomar debate, obviously i believe alomar's side of the story over hirschbecks'. i'm not the only one.

rudy.

[kingjammy24]

Re: Roberto Alomar- sad story if it's true...

From reading the article, whether or not he exposed her to it isn't actually the Legal interest. Morally is another story. But, if she did indeed wait two years after this happened, it's obviously a scheme to try and get money. It's really pathetic, and I'm sure the judge will see it this way as well, this isn't something that you wait two years and then try and pursue, conveniently after the two parted ways. Just my realistic and judicial view on the matter, socially and morally, you could look at it another way.

agreed. she endured this immense emotional distress in feb 2006. so she doesn't file suit in 2006. doesn't file suit in 2007. doesn't file suit in 2008. oh dear, looks like 2009 hit, the economy tanked big time and someone needs money so they dig up something that occurred 3 years ago. only what actually occurred given that she tested negative? oh that's right..she was stressed out! 3 yrs ago! and now its time to collect $15 mill for terrible stress that she endured all the way back then. but hey maybe i'm being extreme and most people typically wait 3 years after a non-offense has occurred to sue.

if it turns out that robbie has AIDS then with the current advances in AIDS medicines, hopefully he can continue to live a long, productive life like magic johnson has. if it turns out he doesn't have AIDS, then i hope he countersues until she's left with just enough to spend the rest of her days in some gutter. until then, i'm not going to presume to know the full story.

rudy.

[aeneas01]

Re: Roberto Alomar- sad story if it's true...

as for the hirschbeck vs alomar debate, obviously i believe alomar's side of the story over hirschbecks'. i'm not the only one.

hirschbeck vs alomar smacks of chrsitian vs hudson...

[Dewey2007]

Re: Roberto Alomar- sad story if it's true...

Looking at this from a completely game used perspective I can see one reason for Rudy's strong reaction to this story. He just got a '92 Alomar Jays jersey which was a grail item and this whole Alomar/Aids story I would guess puts a bit of a damper on the enjoyment in getting the jersey.

It would to me if I received say a Willie Stargell jersey and the next week I found out he infected someone with Aids. The fact that he is one of your favorite players and then he is accused of something so bad it would take a lot of joy out of it whether he was guilty or not.

I could be completely off base with this observation but since this is a game used forum this is the first thing I thought of when reading through this thread.

[kingjammy24]

Re: Roberto Alomar- sad story if it's true...

Looking at this from a completely game used perspective I can see one reason for Rudy's strong reaction to this story. He just got a '92 Alomar Jays jersey which was a grail item and this whole Alomar/Aids story I would guess puts a bit of a damper on the enjoyment in getting the jersey.

hey dewey

nah not really. it's still a killer shirt. IF alomar does have AIDS, then i think it's sad but it doesn't reflect on what he did in the 90s as a player. it's not like finding out he juiced it all those years. if he has AIDS, then i guess he just made some bad choices in his personal life and obviously he's bearing the full brunt of it. honestly, the enjoyment of the shirt hasn't diminished at all. obviously i'm a fan of alomars'. the shirt, from every aspect, is phenomenal. i guess i'm just a little perplexed at everyone wholeheartedly believing the lawsuit immediately upon reading it. i was just pointing out some of the oddities and reserving my final judgement. i'd do the same for any other player. if frank thomas or robin yount or whoever was hit with the same lawsuit, i'd be making the same posts.

anyway, it's not like magic's announcement in '91 diminished anything for his fans or even dinged the value of his items. magic made his announcement in '91 and you look at how active and involved he is today and it doesn't seem like HIV had any impact on him. as i said, if alomar has it, then hopefully he can live a long, productive life and enjoy his HOF enshrinement next year. the '92 and '93 jays and all of their accomplishments still stand untainted, regardless of whether alomar acquired AIDS after he retired or not. regarding his sexual orientation, i couldn't care less. straight, gay, bisexual, asexual, whatever. none of it pertains to his on-field performance or even his character. mickey mantle was still mickey mantle despite his life turning out less than ideal at the very end.

in fact, i just made an inquiry today towards getting more alomar items

rudy.