O'Keeffe: More Hobby Subpoenas

[frikativ54]

Re: O'Keeffe: More Hobby Subpoenas

If you're an auction house who knowingly sold bad items, it's gotta be tough to sleep at night.

This is where your mistake lies, Eric. You are assuming that the people who sold bad items have a moral conscience. A number of con men - whether they doctor jerseys and bats, grossly overcharge, and lie about their products - don't have scruples at all.

The point is, Eric, that these people don't lose sleep at night. They go about their business, duping collector after collector, and amassing not paltry fortunes. The bottom line is that these people think they are above the FBI, above the Better Business Bureau, and above any code of ethics.

These frauds need to be investigated because not only do they deceive us, but also because they are narcissistic sociopaths.

[Lokee]

Re: O'Keeffe: More Hobby Subpoenas

i agree very touch to sleep for those people.

[Eric]

Re: O'Keeffe: More Hobby Subpoenas

Here's what excites me about the whole investigation.

There's a good chance that auction houses who have screwed their customers with shill bidding and bad items over the years will soon be screwing each other over by cooperating with the feds and giving up info on their competitors.

Many of these guys have either worked at more than one house or know people who work at other houses.

With some of the characters we know in this hobby, don't you think some are talking in order to save themselves?

If you're an auction house who knowingly sold bad items, it's gotta be tough to sleep at night.

[suicide_squeeze]

Re: O'Keeffe: More Hobby Subpoenas

Eric,

Obviously the Feds are involved, as they have been busting some serious criminals over the past decade or so in the biz.

Certainly they are actively following up on complaints, leads, etc., by people like ourselves who have exposed so much bad stuff. And what better place to catch a fish, then a fish bowl full of 'em like the National? It's their one-stop shopping subpoena delivery store!

Also, this opportunity fulfills another major goal in law enforcement: Being visably active at these events acts as a deterrent to the criminals. Who wants to answer questions from a roaming Fed about an item they have hanging in their box?? None of them, I'm sure......unless of course it's absolutely authentic. And as we all know, none of the dealers in this business know if that's the case a large majority of the time.

[Lokee]

Re: O'Keeffe: More Hobby Subpoenas

I had a team issued Portland basketball jersey for sale on ebay was of a common player. Someone asked me if I would take less because they have to factor in changing the name on the back to a "star" player.

I now know not to buy anything off this ebay dealer.

[lund6771]

Re: O'Keeffe: More Hobby Subpoenas

Eric,

could it be that the recipients have little to nothing in common? maybe the FBI knows fraud is rampant in this hobby, and is fishing for a link between anyone, whether is be authenticators, consignors, auction houses, etc. I think the FBI already knows shill bidding is a problem, but may be more interested in the origin of the garbage in the market. to me, cards, and memorabilia are two sperate evils in that people creating fake jerseys, etc are most likely not pumping out fake cards as well (in my opinion).

mark

"fishing" is what I think happens at the beginning of the game...I think the suits are way past fishing....once the indictments start, the singing will follow

[allstarsplus]

Re: O'Keeffe: More Hobby Subpoenas

This article has to bel good for business when it comes to MLB Auctions, NFL Auctions, team sites, Upper Deck Authenticated and a few others that deal direct and have control.

When there are problems with those guys, it is probably a mistake and nothing more.

This is why you see collectors paying large premiums on the MLB and NFL Auction sites.

When a collector reads O'Keeffe's article it just pushes them more to the edge with respect to any non-affiliated dealers and this economy it makes it an easier decision not to be an item.

I had 2 bats I was selling from the same player. One bat had a MLB hologram and the other one didn't. The one without the hologram had better use, but the buyer preferred having the one with the MLB #'d hologram. That's the best example I can use for modern collectors.

[markize]

Re: O'Keeffe: More Hobby Subpoenas

Getting back to the topic, what do we think the recipients of the subpoenas have in common- consignors? authenticators? they're not all auction houses. Sounds to me like it's a combination of memorabilia and cards they are looking at.
Could it be about disclosure of restorations? Shill bidding? How do you prove that someone knowingly sold something that isn't as represented?
Interested in people's thoughts.

Eric,

could it be that the recipients have little to nothing in common? maybe the FBI knows fraud is rampant in this hobby, and is fishing for a link between anyone, whether is be authenticators, consignors, auction houses, etc. I think the FBI already knows shill bidding is a problem, but may be more interested in the origin of the garbage in the market. to me, cards, and memorabilia are two sperate evils in that people creating fake jerseys, etc are most likely not pumping out fake cards as well (in my opinion).

mark

[both-teams-played-hard]

Re: O'Keeffe: More Hobby Subpoenas

Getting back to the topic, what do we think the recipients of the subpoenas have in common- consignors? authenticators? they're not all auction houses. Sounds to me like it's a combination of memorabilia and cards they are looking at.
Could it be about disclosure of restorations? Shill bidding? How do you prove that someone knowingly sold something that isn't as represented?
Interested in people's thoughts.

It would be nice if they were going after the people who "build" fake jerseys. The forgers who transform commons into superstar shirts. There are many who knowingly consign bogus stuff. I wouldn't want to be the prosecutor who tries to make that case. Seems impossible.
I bet it's about cards.

i dont get the reference.

Elroy Cohen gets the Gas Face. 20-year old reference to Pete Nash who has a current beef with hobby big-wig Robert Lifson. A battle that peaks my interest. Far more interesting than Kool Moe Dee v. L.L. Cool J or even Eminem v. Mariah.
Pete Nash (Nice) is exposing the fact that Lifson allegedly stole baseball artifacts from the New York Public Library in the 1970s.

[Eric]

Re: O'Keeffe: More Hobby Subpoenas

Getting back to the topic, what do we think the recipients of the subpoenas have in common- consignors? authenticators? they're not all auction houses. Sounds to me like it's a combination of memorabilia and cards they are looking at.
Could it be about disclosure of restorations? Shill bidding? How do you prove that someone knowingly sold something that isn't as represented?
Interested in people's thoughts.

[joelsabi]

Re: O'Keeffe: More Hobby Subpoenas

Elroy, Elroy, Elroy Cohen......

i dont get the reference.

[markize]

Re: O'Keeffe: More Hobby Subpoenas

Fraud and shill bidding get the Gas Face...

Elroy, Elroy, Elroy Cohen......

[suicide_squeeze]

Re: O'Keeffe: More Hobby Subpoenas

I am thrilled that the FBI is cracking down on the fraud in the hobby. Some of these dealers think that they are above the law, and that they can fake jerseys and bats and get away with it. This is a billion dollar industry, and there has to be some accountability. The FBI's investigation is long overdue.

In my mind, anything we can do to help collectors is worth it. People like me have spent thousands of dollars on jerseys, bats, and and batting gloves. The least that the government owes us is a safe environment for the exchange of game-used memorabilia.

Not everyone in this hobby has ethics, so government oversight becomes necessary.

My vote for:

POST OF THE DAY!!!

[frikativ54]

Re: O'Keeffe: More Hobby Subpoenas

I get frustrated sometimes hearing about the FBI cracking down and doing this kinda thing. It baffles me to know that people would rather know about the counterfeit jersey's, bats etc... OVER the real things that matter in todays world.

I am thrilled that the FBI is cracking down on the fraud in the hobby. Some of these dealers think that they are above the law, and that they can fake jerseys and bats and get away with it. This is a billion dollar industry, and there has to be some accountability. The FBI's investigation is long overdue.

In my mind, anything we can do to help collectors is worth it. People like me have spent thousands of dollars on jerseys, bats, and and batting gloves. The least that the government owes us is a safe environment for the exchange of game-used memorabilia.

Not everyone in this hobby has ethics, so government oversight becomes necessary.

[Lokee]

Re: O'Keeffe: More Hobby Subpoenas



Thanks for understanding