New AMI Model = Seller's Authenticate Own Lots?

[aeneas01]

Re: New AMI Model = Seller's Authenticate Own Lots?

apples and oranges. we were discussing an auction house.

my bad, i thought we were discussing the tremendously arduous task of taking a photo of an item and describing it - and the tremendous level of skill, talent and knowledge required to pull something like that off!

is the implication here that the lots would not have received higher bids with better presentation?

heck no! i thought $170,000 for that flannel was a steal, dirt cheap - obviously the single photo doomed it from the start!

why bother? as you said, ebay's successful. 23 million listings. give your daughter a polaroid and call it a day.

an interesting thought indeed - but mom would probably balk, the school thing and all... perhaps during a summer auction? we'll see.

if AMI has eliminated those factors, what seperates them from ebay?

i'll tell ya one thing that separates them - ebay lots don't claim to have been authenticated by the "100% authentication team" when they haven't!

what exactly is the point of consigning to AMI? you say it's the opportunity to write their own descriptions, perform their own authentications and take their own photos. big deal.

so now you have me saying that it's the "opportunity" to take your own photos, dictate your own spiels and stamp your own lots that's the rub... before you had me saying that it was the "joy" of taking your own photos, etc., etc... oy vey!

as i've mentioned a couple of times before, here's the the point of consigning to ami if you're owed money:

1. you can work your own lot descriptions (and all that this implies).
2. you can evaluate your own item(s) (and all that this implies).
3. you can take your own photos (and all that this implies).
4. ami will place hidden (secret) reserves on your lot(s).
5. ami will bid your lot(s) up to the hidden (secret) reserve.
6. ami will create the illusion of activity, interest and value in your lot(s) by bidding it up to the hidden reserve.
7. ami will allow you to hold onto your lot(s), so there's no risk of losing it.
8. ami will not require that your lot(s) pass a pro evaluation.
9. ami will imply that your lot(s) have been evaluated by their "100% authentic team" by including this reference on each lot page.
10. ami will not reveal these details to the bidding audience. or at least not make them very apparent.

so you see rudy, the "opportunity" and/or "joy" of dictating your own lot description, stamping your own lots and presenting whichever photo you feel best tells the story you want to tell is just part of the point in consigning to ami.

you're no longer going to get the auction house premium hammer price once people realize AMI is more of a third-rate ebay than a traditional auction house.

i think that's obvious - but what's equally obvious, at least to me, is the window hasn't closed yet. and it's time to get while the gettin's good....

beyond that, i'm curious behind the real motivations of these consigners you mention... why would a consignor want their item not to have third-party authentication when the general consensus in this hobby is that it increases hammer price?

who says an ami consignor is not going to benefit from a third-party authentication in terms of hammer price? at the bottom of each ami lot a bidder will find this: authenticator - 100% authentic team.

...but once you start authenticating your own items, your opinions can no longer be taken as seriously.

i disagree rudy. if i was in the market for a late '80s, early '90s blue jays shirt do you think i would hesitate buying one from you if you told me it was authentic, showed me why it was authentic, authenticated it? of course not. perhaps that's just me but i don't think so - i believe everyone that knows you would do the same based on the well-earned respect they have for your knowledge in that area. like most things, i think it's a case by case sitch....

obviously i can't read roger's mind but was it really the ability to take his own photos and authenticate his own jerseys that sold him on AMI?

i certainly won't speak for roger, but i think it's abundantly clear that ami offered owed consignors quite a few incentives...

as opposed to suing you, collecting full payment plus any damages incurred and never having to deal with you again...

yeah, nothing to that suing game - especially when you're out of state. easy money. pick up the phone and it's done. and it won't cost you a thing 'cause attorneys are lining up to take these cases on a contingency basis. mama mia rudy... the bleak reality is the best a consignor could hope for in a sitch like this would be a speedy settlement that he could stomach - out of which he would have to cover his attorneys fees. screw a settlement and push for trial? better have a sense of adventure, deep pockets and lots of time on your hands - real court 'ain't people's court! so what's another option? giving the debtor a chance to pay in full....

...

[kingjammy24]

Re: New AMI Model = Seller's Authenticate Own Lots?

"given the skill, knowledge and talent apparently required to ready a lot for auction, it's kinda hard to believe that ebay ever got off the ground, eh my friend? 23 million ebay listings as we speak, who knew there was so much damn talent out there?!?"

there isn't. it's well known that ebay listings typically fetch noticeably lower hammer prices on similar items than auction houses. if it didn't, there'd be no reason to consign to an auction house. secondly, ebay's substantially lower premiums mean that consumers on both sides of the coin don't have the same expectations as they would if they were paying the typical 20/20. they don't have the same expectations and consequently they don't pay as much. apples and oranges. we were discussing an auction house.

the operating environments and factors for success for ebay vs auction houses are different.

"here are four photos, from four different lots.."

is the implication here that the lots would not have received higher bids with better presentation?

"this kind of work can be a chore, especially if done carefully and right - i know, we're in the process of doing just that right now."

why bother? as you said, ebay's successful. 23 million listings. give your daughter a polaroid and call it a day.

"you can't tell me that there aren't consignors out there that are jumping at the opportunity to finally be able to sell their items through a major auction house on their own terms - with their own descriptions, evaluations and photos. there are, i've spoken to a couple."

the main reason auction houses fetch higher prices than ebay is because of their percieved added-value; specifically, professional presentation and authentication. if AMI has eliminated those factors, what seperates them from ebay? the fact that they have 1/1000th the audience or their 20% buyer's premium vs. ebay's 0%? that is, once you eliminate the value-added features that enable auction houses to collect higher hammer prices, what exactly is the point of consigning to AMI? you say it's the opportunity to write their own descriptions, perform their own authentications and take their own photos. big deal, you can do all of that on ebay while reaching a substantially bigger market and you don't have to deal with victor moreno or kieta. you're no longer going to get the auction house premium hammer price once people realize AMI is more of a third-rate ebay than a traditional auction house. so if consigners are no longer receiving the auction house premium from AMI what's the point?

beyond that, i'm curious behind the real motivations of these consigners you mention. why would a consigner prefer their own photography to that of a professionals? why would a consigner want their item not to have third-party authentication when the general consensus in this hobby is that it increases hammer price? i can see why they'd want to write their own descriptions but i have trouble understanding legit reasoning behind the others. did roger gibson really feel that the only way to do his jerseys justice was to have a brick-wall background? or that collectors would certainly pay more for his jerseys if they knew that they were authenticated by the same person who owned them? undoubtedly roger is a knowledgable NFL collector but once you start authenticating your own items, your opinions can no longer be taken as seriously. dave bushing has been down that path. obviously i can't read roger's mind but was it really the ability to take his own photos and authenticate his own jerseys that sold him on AMI?

anyway, in this particular instance with AMI, there's more to it than simply consigners selling on their own terms. there's the entire issue of dealing with a company with a long, sordid history of customer dissatisfaction on multiple levels and that's what i meant when i questioned why anyone would do business with them. i understand the terms seem attractive to some but to me, there are no terms attractive enough to deal with victor moreno/kieta.

"let's say i owe my oyster wholesaler a bunch of money. why would he continue to broker through me?.."

as opposed to suing you, collecting full payment plus any damages incurred and never having to deal with you again? i don't know.
you sell oysters and have an established clientele. big deal, there are others i can sell to, receive prompt payment in full and not incur the headaches of dealing with lying deadbeats. for me, life is too short to deal with people like that regardless of what terms they promise. i do understand that if i was the sort of wholesaler who deliberately didn't want his oysters inspected, then i'd choose you. however, roger doesn't strike me as the kind of guy who has to hide his oysters.

rudy.

[aeneas01]

Re: New AMI Model = Seller's Authenticate Own Lots?

practically the only universal truth about every consigner is that they want to maximize the hammer price of their item and one way to do so is to present the item as impressively as possible. this requires skill, knowledge and talent that many don't have...

given the skill, knowledge and talent apparently required to ready a lot for auction, it's kinda hard to believe that ebay ever got off the ground, eh my friend? 23 million ebay listings as we speak, who knew there was so much damn talent out there?!?

here are four photos, from four different lots, snagged from a couple of major sports memorabilia auction houses - they represent the only photo that was featured in each lot and are presented exactly as they were at the auction houses (same size, rez, etc.). call me crazy, but i don't think ansel or henri knocked these things out - in fact i'm pretty certain my 10-year-old daughter, equipped with your 4mp powershot, could best the effort.....

lot sold for $170,000


lot sold for $31,000


lot sold for $17,000


lot sold for $13,000



and here are four lot descriptions taken from a couple of major sports memorabilia auction houses, presented in their entirety. not sure how much creative literary talent, skill or knowledge it would take to do the same....

1. Flannel jersey with Tim McAuliffe tag in the collar. The words "Red Sox" are spelled out in felt on the front and Kramer's number "18" are applied in felt to the back. A small fabric swatch with the year "48" is sewn to the tail. Vintage number change. Condition: No holes or tears but does show heavy use with wear evident on the letters, numbers and piping.

2. These professional model weapons were turned to the specifications of their namesakes, Maris and Mantle: 1.) 1964-1967 Adirondack "307D" block-letter ("MARIS TYPE") model (32.8oz/34", 11" crack); 2.) 1968-1970 Adirondack "288D" block-letter ("MANTLE TYPE") model (35.8oz/34"); and 3.) 1973-1975 Hillerich & Bradsby "K55" Mickey Mantle signature model (30.6oz/35"). Heavy to excessive use throughout. Individual photo LOAs from John Taube PSA/DNA.

3. This head gear of the Bills offensive lineman Sherman White during his last season in the NFL shows nice use with scuffs and has the number "83" on the back in sticker form. Rawlings size 7 1/8-7 1/4 helmet has 1983 recertification sticker inside ear flap. Complete with padding inside. This also was the last year for the dominant white background color of the Buffalo helmet, replaced by the present red.

4. Presented is a white and black Everlast satin robe signed by Muhammad Ali. The black Sharpie signature of the former heavyweight champion is located above the lower left pocket and grades (“6”) with moderate bleeding. This handsome garment features excellent construction, gorgeous material and is accompanied by an auction LOA from James Spence Authentications.

-------------------

granted, if your looking for "creamily delicious" then you would certainly have to call in the heavy hitters! seriously rudy, all kidding aside and ignoring the extreme examples i included above, i understand your point completely. i really do. this kind of work can be a chore, especially if done carefully and right - i know, we're in the process of doing just that right now. but you can't tell me that there aren't consignors out there that are jumping at the opportunity to finally be able to sell their items through a major auction house on their own terms - with their own descriptions, evaluations and photos. there are, i've spoken to a couple.

is it an enormous amount of work to competently prepare 5-10 of your own lots for auction? does it require a unique and special level of skill, knowledge and talent? no, not when you're talking about experienced collectors, which most of those consignors are i believe. to tell you the truth rudy, i'm a little surprised to hear that you think so highly of the collective skills/talents of paid evaluators given the brutal time you often give them!

a) what good is it to bidders if AMI is only collecting their cash but not the consigner's goods? b) IF ami was operating as a proper escrow service, then your suggestion that consigners could "..decide whether or not they wish to honor the deal once the auction is over, once they receive their cash" would be impossible.

a) exactly b) who said ami was operating as a proper escrow service?

tell you what.. offer your own customers an "absurd opportunity" to become "willing and active participants" in the food they eat. how? make them cook it all themselves....

funny, but not an accurate analogy - customers are the bidders, not the consignors. how about this - let's say i owe my oyster wholesaler a bunch of money. why would he continue to broker through me? well i sell a lot of oysters, have an established oyster clientele. and not only does he want to get the money back i owe him but he also wants to sell oysters. so i offer to split my oyster profits with him (buyers premium + sellers premium) to pay down my debt and tell him i won't inspect them when they come in, won't check out the lot tag to ensure they are what he says they are (which we normally do religiously). further, i'll allow him to bring me my order each day and pick up what i don't use at the end of the day to ensure that i don't accumulate an inventory that i can't pay for. i would say that would be a compelling proposition and that he would be interested in being a willing and active participant...

if an item has a hidden reserve and the reserve is ultimately not reached, can the auction house/consigner still sell the item to the highest bidder? if so, then wouldn't placing an astronomical hidden reserve (say $10 million) enable the auction house to bid throughout the entire auction until the very end? sure the hidden reserve isn't met but if it's hidden, noone knows (except the auction houes and consigner tee hee) and the auction house/consigner are free to sell it to the highest (inflated) bid. the item was constantly bid up by the auction house but it's all legal because it was never technically "in play". the auction house can bid on an item all it likes, and view bidder's max bids, as long as they never put the item into play which they can do simply by setting an astronomical hidden reserve.

exactly.

...

[aeneas01]

Re: New AMI Model = Seller's Authenticate Own Lots?

Why does this thread sound like an argument?

i hear ya ken and i wish it hadn't gone in that direction...

hidden (secret) reserves, auction houses bidding on lots on behalf of their consignors, consignors allowed to bid on their own items, viewable/accessible max (up to bids), consignors evaluating their own items, auction house claiming they're evaluating items when they're not - it goes on and on. and it's going on at this very moment. you would think that would be plenty to discuss...

...

[aeneas01]

Re: New AMI Model = Seller's Authenticate Own Lots?

You're obviously taking my comments as some personal attack on your integrity, which they are not.

news flash michael - when you presumptuously and publicly accuse someone of lacking objectivity because of money, not only is it a personal attack on that person's integrity but on their character as well. do you really need that explained to you? and when you claim the same rules don't apply to you, that's the height of hypocrisy. do you really need that explained to you as well?

look michael, if you want to leave the knitting circle and join the men for cigars and brandy, i'm all for it - but try to bring something interesting, useful and helpful to the table instead of poorly crafted devil's advocate arguments and snide and flippant remarks. honestly, i can't remember the last time you've contributed something interesting and uniquely yours to the forum - click on your name, scroll down to "find all posts by mvandor" and you'll see what i mean.

frankly, whether you know it or not, you're one of those internet forum guys that needs to feel relevant yet rarely has anything relevant to contribute. as a result you self-promote, claim the expertise of others as yours, wade out of your depth and jump into any conversation for the sake of jumping, without thinking. and it gets you into trouble. fix this and it would be a good start. and then try to see the forest through the trees rather than bite the hands that feed you.

and in the meantime, for the love of roberto clemente, try to stop throwing folks under the bus when you clumsily try to come across as an insider with something to offer - for example, you recently posted about an individual who was willing to discretely help out honest collectors despite considerable risk. you then, as if to show you were uniquely in the know, proceeded to identify the individual by name, identified his his business and volunteered his email address. good grief...

to the rest of you guys, thanks very much for your support - and thanks to all of you guys that dropped me emails offering the same. really, it's very much appreciated.

...

[mvandor]

Re: New AMI Model = Seller's Authenticate Own Lots?

interesting, michael.... you recently posted the following in response to a forum member asking about an ebay helmet offered by lambeauleeper: "LL is an ebayer that puts together some very good replicas of HOF NFL players, but then sells them misleadingly for big bucks..."

do you feel collectors should consider your criticism of lambeauleeper "clouded" and "little more than an attack on a competitor" as well given you also sell football helmets on ebay? further, do you feel that you lack objectivity when it comes to commenting on bad helmets because you also engage in the buying and selling of helmets? and finally michael, do you feel that your "old school" sensibilities regarding conflicts of interest pertain to you as well?

...

Robert, you're far too bright not to get my point, so you must be in denial.

I don't sell lids as a business, so as you know, the analogy is not accurate.

If I negatively reviewed one of the competitors to my actual business which is my livelihood (I have no side businesses) on a forum, although I might be 100% accurate, I would expect readers to take my opinion with a grain of salt because I'm speaking about a competitor. That simply doesn't scream "objectivity".

You're obviously taking my comments as some personal attack on your integrity, which they are not.

[aeneas01]

Re: New AMI Model = Seller's Authenticate Own Lots?

so i've lost my "mantle of objectivity" have i? tell me michael, was it intact when i took the time to help you out with your tomlinson and montana helmets? when i explained to you what to look for in fake modern helmets so you wouldn't get taken again (by the likes of lambeauleeper)? guu will be offering some helmets in their upcoming fall auction, just as lambeauleeper will be offering helmets on ebay. if i now comment on lambeauleeper will it also strike you as little more than an attack on a competitor?

Robert, yes, if you now have a financial interest in an auction business... any comments you make going forward will be viewed differently.... your heavy involvement in GUU Auctions would still cast a cloud over your criticisms of competing auction houses... (it creates) what us old schoolers used to consider a "conflict of interest" when you post criticisms of what would now appear to be competitors.

interesting, michael.... you recently posted the following in response to a forum member asking about an ebay helmet offered by lambeauleeper: "LL is an ebayer that puts together some very good replicas of HOF NFL players, but then sells them misleadingly for big bucks..."

do you feel collectors should consider your criticism of lambeauleeper "clouded" and "little more than an attack on a competitor" as well given you also sell football helmets on ebay? further, do you feel that you lack objectivity when it comes to commenting on bad helmets because you also engage in the buying and selling of helmets? and finally michael, do you feel that your "old school" sensibilities regarding conflicts of interest pertain to you as well?

...

[xpress34]

Re: New AMI Model = Seller's Authenticate Own Lots?

Wow... maybe I missed something in trolling through all of the stating and rehashing of AMI's new 'business model', but here is the very eerie feeling I'm coming away with...

It has been made VERY clear here that Victor has screwed consignors and creditors 8 ways to Sunday - correct???

And one of the big points is that the 20% Buyer's Premium is going to go to pay off some of those debts and consignors - correct???

And the current consignors get to keep their item UNTIL they get paid - correct???

And finally, AMI is acting as their own 'so-called' Escrow (and as was stated earlier, they are not doing what a true Escrow service would do) in collecting the money for the consignors - correct???

These all lead to one VERY disturbing conclusion for me - as it should for ANY bidders:

Let's say AMI has 100 items 'consigned' (for lack of a better or 'real' term) to their current auction and assume that EVERY item sells and AMI collects on every auction... now, the 'consignors' still have their items, so technically, AMI doesn't owe them for their items - they still possess them... what is to keep this from being their LAST auction and them just skipping town with the proceeds that they helped increase with 'shill bidding' (hidden reserve)???

I mean yes, they could have done it in the past, but now, they are collecting money for items they don't even possess?!?!?

Compared to everything else I've ever read about AMI, this scenario doesn't seem too crazy or bizarre to me...

Just my .02

- Chris

[earlywynnfan]

Re: New AMI Model = Seller's Authenticate Own Lots?

Why does this thread sound like an argument? It started off so well.

Ken

[kingjammy24]

Re: New AMI Model = Seller's Authenticate Own Lots?

robert,

you're too sharp a guy to believe that simply because you find something enjoyable that others necessarily would as well. practically the only universal truth about every consigner is that they want to maximize the hammer price of their item and one way to do so is to present the item as impressively as possible. this requires skill, knowledge and talent that many don't have and have no interest in learning. you seem to believe it's fun and not a burden trying to present your item as well as it would appear at REA or Heritage with a copy of MS Paint and a 4 megapixel powershot. (hell i don't even have a mannequin. but maybe that's part of the "fun" of it all..going and purchasing a few thousand dollars worth of professional equipment and then learning how to use it all). i guess if you believe it's such a joy then i expect you'll be asking future GUU consigners to take their own photos. why not right? wouldn't pose any burden to anyone because everyone loves photography. at the same time, it'd save chris cavalier the time and expense. when they complain that their items weren't professionally presented, just tell them to think of all the fun they had.

"if ami is now acting as an escrow service then what's changed in terms of ensuring that they distribute the cash they've collected?"

in this situation, a proper escrow service would involve more than the distribution of cash. it would involve the distribution of goods. what good is it to bidders if AMI is only collecting their cash but not the consigner's goods? IF ami was operating as a proper escrow service, then your suggestion that consigners could "..decide whether or not they wish to honor the deal once the auction is over, once they receive their cash" would be impossible.

"..seems to me the only way ami was able to convince some consignors that they would receive the cash for their lots once the auction ended was to allow the consignors to keep their lots until cash was in their hands, no?"

i don't know. later in your post you pose the same scenario and then almost rhetorically ask me "would ami really allow this?" so i don't know what you really believe is happening. personally, i wasn't sure how AMI was able to convince anyone to do business with them. hence why i asked if roger gibson could provide some insight into what compelled him to do business with such a company.

"..but you consider this work and a burden while i consider an absurd opportunity, not work, made possible only because of ami's predicament. you can't convince me otherwise and i can't convince you - which is the sort of thing that makes life more interesting."

tell you what.. offer your own customers an "absurd opportunity" to become "willing and active participants" in the food they eat. how? make them cook it all themselves. after all, it is their food so they've got a vested interest in trying to make it good. your job? exactly what AMI does..just sit back and charge them for doing the work...err..having the "fun". don't know how to cook? hey, many of AMI's customers have little clue about professional photography but they're probably having a blast learning! did your jersey come out looking crappy and thus fail to fetch a great price? no different than your food coming out crappy because you had no clue how to operate the broiler. hey the AMI folks probably had no clue what an f-stop on a nikon d90 was the first time either. it's always fun when you have no clue what you're doing!

"..creative writing and photography are two wonderfully joyous pursuits."

the assumption being that since you personally enjoy it then everyone else does as well? that it's a wonderfully joyous thing when all you want is make your roger staubach helmet look great and yet everything keeps coming out blurry and dark so you spend 5 hours trolling photography forums without any clue as to what any of the terms mean? or engaging in creative writing when you feel immensely inept with the written word? i agree..couldn't be a burden to anyone as it's well known that all collectors love professional photography and creative writing and are greatly skilled at both. oy. one man's joy is another man's burden.

rudy.

[suicide_squeeze]

Re: New AMI Model = Seller's Authenticate Own Lots?

Robert, yes, if you now have a financial interest in an auction business (I assume you're not donating your time/expertise to someone else's business), any comments you make going forward will be viewed differently. You take that as a personal afront? It's not, it would be true for Jesus Christ himself, it's a very fair statement that has nothing to do with you personally.

Of course, if what sounds like a substantial contribution of your time IS sans any monetary remuneration, that colors your PERCEIVED objectivity less in my opinion, however your heavy involvement in GUU Auctions would still cast a cloud over your criticisms of competing auction houses.

Does that lessen my appreciation for what you bring to GUU members with your expertise, or what you specifically have assisted me or others on here? Of course not. Does it lessen my respect for you? Not at all, you're #1 in my list here.

But it does create what us old schoolers used to consider a "conflict of interest" when you post criticisms of what would now appear to be competitors.

If the roles were reversed, I would honestly expect you to say the same about me.

mvandor,

With all due respect to a good forum member as I consider you are, if Robert states facts backed up by evidence related to them, how can that shed any "attack" on another auction house, or tarnish his comments on items that are unquestionable bad, simply because he is performing a very needed service for the auctions here on the GUU? I see it as a plus to the hobby in every way, shape, and form. He has shown obvious and overwhelming knowledge over the so-called "experts" in the hobby (at least in regards to football memorabilia).

This forum has exposed and displayed in black and white miles and miles of evidence against the competency of the authenticators utilized by the major auction houses in the industry. In some cases, the very fact that the "authenticators" are referred to as such, IMO, is borderline breaking the law. They are rediculously inept at identifying what they are holding in thier own hands as to the true authenticity of what the piece is.

I have no problem with whatever the service, pay, arrangements, or otherwise Robert has in regards to being "employed" by GUU to work with or on their auctions. It can only add to the integrity of this site, their auction experience, and help to protect the collecting public from buying an item that turns up being something other than what it is offered to be.

It's an absolute win-win for everyone who uses this site. And I would go as far as saying we all will never see the day where Robert would cross the line and sell his soul to the devil for financial gain while authenticating "garbage" in an auction, like so many of the so called expert authenticators have done. There just wouldn't be any reason for that, as he would be exposed by the very same site that he is serving in no time whatsoever. Then, and only then, would he lose cred here. I don't see it, his integrity appears to be too high for that.

Thumbs up to GUU for utilizing his knowledge. It's all good in my book.

[suicide_squeeze]

Re: New AMI Model = Seller's Authenticate Own Lots?

so i've lost my "mantle of objectivity" have i? tell me michael, was it intact when i took the time to help you out with your tomlinson and montana helmets? when i explained to you what to look for in fake modern helmets so you wouldn't get taken again?

guu will be offering some helmets in their upcoming fall auction, just as lambeauleeper will be offering helmets on ebay. if i now comment on lambeauleeper will it also strike you as little more than an attack on a competitor?

...

Robert,

As any seasoned collector is aware, anything that is stated by a knowledgeable hobbiest like yourself who posesses deep insight into the authenticity of the items being offered into the hobby is appreciated.

If what you discuss is true, and what you present are facts that back your statements......I don't care if you're selling tickets to the next "Jimmy Carter Communism Tea-Party" gathering......it has deep relevance and is welcome by any collector.

Don't ever stop posting. It would be a serious loss to the forum members who enjoy this site.

[mvandor]

Re: New AMI Model = Seller's Authenticate Own Lots?

so i've lost my "mantle of objectivity" have i? tell me michael, was it intact when i took the time to help you out with your tomlinson and montana helmets? when i explained to you what to look for in fake modern helmets so you wouldn't get taken again?

guu will be offering some helmets in their upcoming fall auction, just as lambeauleeper will be offering helmets on ebay. if i now comment on lambeauleeper will it also strike you as little more than an attack on a competitor?

...

Robert, yes, if you now have a financial interest in an auction business (I assume you're not donating your time/expertise to someone else's business), any comments you make going forward will be viewed differently. You take that as a personal afront? It's not, it would be true for Jesus Christ himself, it's a very fair statement that has nothing to do with you personally.

Of course, if what sounds like a substantial contribution of your time IS sans any monetary remuneration, that colors your PERCEIVED objectivity less in my opinion, however your heavy involvement in GUU Auctions would still cast a cloud over your criticisms of competing auction houses.

Does that lessen my appreciation for what you bring to GUU members with your expertise, or what you specifically have assisted me or others on here? Of course not. Does it lessen my respect for you? Not at all, you're #1 in my list here.

But it does create what us old schoolers used to consider a "conflict of interest" when you post criticisms of what would now appear to be competitors.

If the roles were reversed, I would honestly expect you to say the same about me.

[commando]

Re: New AMI Model = Seller's Authenticate Own Lots?

The idea that Robert, or any other individual, cannot be objective because they're compensated for their knowledge, is insane. Why shouldn't someone who knows more than virtually anyone else on a subject (a true expert) NOT get compensated for their knowledge? Do you think people go to medical school to not get paid? Sure, doctors volunteer their time here and there... And yes, a few doctors over the years have been caught doing extra, unneeded procedures to make extra money.... But come on, if you think this type of greedy behavior is the norm, then you're jaded, my friend.

Oh, and I realize Robert's game-used education probably didn't cost as much as medical school... But if you think learning what Robert has learned was free, and didn't take a huge investment in time and resources, you're wrong again.

Come on, people. Think about who you're talking about (or get to know them) before you throw someone under the bus.

[shoremen44]

Re: New AMI Model = Seller's Authenticate Own Lots?

Well, just like GUU lost it's mantle of objectivity when it decided to become an auction venue, you just gave up yours as well. For example, while I agree with you 100% re: AMI, your comments now come across as little more than an attack on a competitor.

Life ain't the same after you dive into the money pool, my friend.

I dont know aneas01 personally, but I have to say that I have ever seen is objectivity, and concern for the collector from him.

With that said from someone who has dealt with AMI in the past (and is still owed money) they deserve every negative comment that comes their way... if anything that is said isnt true we would all comment, but all the crap they have pulled is right there for everyone to see.

Furthermore, Chris and GUU has never been anything but helpful and objective in my mind, but why should Chris, aneas01, or GUU have to be objective when it comes to competition?... It's business, GUU should laud their positives, and while a good business should never focus on another companies negatives, knowing them and informing your customers of them and why you are better when they ask is simply good business.