Jeter Not Mvp ?

[cjclong]

Re: Jeter Not Mvp ?

I'm not saying anybody's ballot should be invalidated. If I had a vote I would look at the years the players had. If one player had clearly out performed the other then that player should win. If a veteran player and a newcomer were essentially tied then I would go with the veteran player. Obviously some of voters didn't use the standard I would or thought that Morneau clearly outperformed Jeter. I don't think that, but its their vote and their decison. Morneau won the award. There is nothing in the rules that says prior service should be considered. That's just my opinion. As I said, others can differ. There have been cases where out of bad judgment or personal anomosity a player who was deserving didn't get a vote. One year when Joe Dimaggio barely edged out Ted Williams for the MVP one voter didn't name Williams at all on his ballot at any level. To have done that almost surrely meant that person disliked Williams. One of the voters put Jeter 6th which seems pretty low. I'm not saying this voter disliked Jeter, but that does seem like a lapse in judgment. To pose a question: Should there be two awards voted by the writers- MVP and Outstanding player. There has always been the question of whether a player on a team that finishes far out of the running can be the MVP. If a team finished last with you, they could finish last without you. In some years the writers might think the Outstanding Player and the MVP were one and the same. In other years different players might win the two awards.

[suave1477]

Re: Jeter Not Mvp ?

I read everyones post here and I find it interesting how members here are not looking at the facts or not realizing the facts.

I did not follow Morneaus season so I am going by what members here have said about him!!!

From what I gather Mourneau had a bad begining of the season and then came back strong at the latter half the season to lead his team to the playoffs, if this is correct??? (THEN HE DESERVES THE COMEBACK PLAYER OF THE YEAR AWARD NOT MVP)

As far as saying Jeter played in a great lineup and the Yankees could have made it with out him to the playoffs is crazy to say either.
What lineup?
Hideki was out hurt
Sheffield was out hurt
Cano was out for 1/3 of the season hurt
Cairo was out for 1/5 of the season hurt
Damon is playing with a broken bone in his foot
Posada is playing with a torn ligament behind one of his knees
Giambi was no where to be found with a .253 BA
Abreu didn't come in to the later part of the season
AROD was non existent unless the Yankees were up by 10

How about Pitching?
WE HAD NONE!!!
Mussina and Wang were good!!!

But lets go through all the bad
Ponson
Lidle
Johnson
Farnsworth
Myers
Beam
Pavano - non existent
Wright - a Joke!!!

Your telling me Jeter carry an ailing team??????

Lets not forget Jeter had something like a 26 Game Hitting Streak!!!

Jeter carried the team for the WHOLE season not HALF

JETER DESERVES THE MVP AWARD HANDS DOWN!!!

[sylbry]

Re: Jeter Not Mvp ?

I read everyones post here and I find it interesting how members here are not looking at the facts or not realizing the facts.

I did not follow Morneaus season so I am going by what members here have said about him!!!

From what I gather Mourneau had a bad begining of the season and then came back strong at the latter half the season to lead his team to the playoffs, if this is correct??? (THEN HE DESERVES THE COMEBACK PLAYER OF THE YEAR AWARD NOT MVP)

As far as saying Jeter played in a great lineup and the Yankees could have made it with out him to the playoffs is crazy to say either.
What lineup?
Hideki was out hurt
Sheffield was out hurt
Cano was out for 1/3 of the season hurt
Cairo was out for 1/5 of the season hurt
Damon is playing with a broken bone in his foot
Posada is playing with a torn ligament behind one of his knees
Giambi was no where to be found with a .253 BA
Abreu didn't come in to the later part of the season
AROD was non existent unless the Yankees were up by 10

How about Pitching?
WE HAD NONE!!!
Mussina and Wang were good!!!

But lets go through all the bad
Ponson
Lidle
Johnson
Farnsworth
Myers
Beam
Pavano - non existent
Wright - a Joke!!!

Your telling me Jeter carry an ailing team??????

Lets not forget Jeter had something like a 26 Game Hitting Streak!!!

Jeter carried the team for the WHOLE season not HALF

JETER DESERVES THE MVP AWARD HANDS DOWN!!!

I don't see any facts in your post. Here are a couple of facts.

Twins won 96 games. Yankees won 97.

Twins won the division by 1 game. Yankees by 10 games.

Combined wins of other teams in their respective divisions: Central = 325, East = 304.

[suave1477]

Re: Jeter Not Mvp ?

I don't see any facts in your post. Here are a couple of facts.

Twins won 96 games. Yankees won 97.

Twins won the division by 1 game. Yankees by 10 games.

Combined wins of other teams in their respective divisions: Central = 325, East = 304.

Twins won 96 Games Yankees won 97 - Exactly Twins didnt do any better

Twins won the division by 1 game Yankees by 10? Yeah not because we got any better but because the Red Sox started playing worse because of there poor pitching - and technically wiining by 10 in my books has always beaten 1

Combined wins I agree it may have been a tad bit harder for the Twins but we werent losing our games gracisouly to the dominant teams we were losing poorly to the bad teams.

I do appreciate you proving my point!!!

As I said before Jeter carried us otherwise we wouldn't have even made as far as we did!!!

[staindsox]

Re: Jeter Not Mvp ?

The Red Sox played worse because they were the most injured team in baseball. At one point, only Loretta and Ortiz were the only two starters still able to play, besides half of the rotation on the staff on the DL. The Sox were twice as injured as the Yankees.

Let's not forget Jeter's indifference in the A-Rod affair. An MVP backs his teammates and pushes and encourages everyone to do their best...Jeter was okay throwing him to the wolves.

If Jeter were truly a team player, he would have moved to third because A-Rod was the best fielding shortstop in the league and it has been statistically proven the Jeter has one of the poorest ranges for a shortstop. That's not an MVP.

[cjclong]

Re: Jeter Not Mvp ?

Why do people keep mentioning ARod and Jeter? What does that have to do with MVP. Is anyone so naive they think all the top players on all the teams like all their teamates. You hear about ARod and Jeter because its New York. If two teamates in Minnesota didn't like each other would we ever hear about it? How many MVP awards has Bonds won amd does he get along with.anyone? And what has Jeter done to ARod that's so terrrible? Name one bad thing he's ever said about him? Can you? You don't have to be everyone's buddy to win. Remember how the Oakland A's had fist fights when Jackson was there. Ruth and Gehrig had a cool relationship for years. Guess neither of them could be MVP? Is there anyone on the team Morneau doesn't like? I don't know and neither do you. Who cares. I've never heard Jeter say anything negative about any teammate. I've heard a lot of other players say negatives about AROD. The big majority of Yankee players would tell you Jeter is a good teamate and a leader. And remember, we're voting for MVP, not miss congeniality.

[suave1477]

Re: Jeter Not Mvp ?

The Red Sox played worse because they were the most injured team in baseball. At one point, only Loretta and Ortiz were the only two starters still able to play, besides half of the rotation on the staff on the DL. The Sox were twice as injured as the Yankees.[/qoute]

I agree with you thats why I said the red Sox were injured badly at the end that is why we were able to take the lead, otherwise we would have to struggle harder to make it.

[qoute]Let's not forget Jeter's indifference in the A-Rod affair. An MVP backs his teammates and pushes and encourages everyone to do their best...Jeter was okay throwing him to the wolves. [/qoute]

There is no love loss between Jeter or ARod this is nothing new as you are correct in the medias eyes he should have backed up ARod but reality is reality and it's hard to fake liking someone, either way because you like somoene or not should not stop you from winnin an award of how you performed on the field

[qoute]If Jeter were truly a team player, he would have moved to third because A-Rod was the best fielding shortstop in the league and it has been statistically proven the Jeter has one of the poorest ranges for a shortstop. That's not an MVP.

Proving Stats of where ARods position should have been is all well and fine but the debate is over Mourneau and Jeter not Arod.

Arod wasn't anywhere near any votes to be considered for MVP
ARod also was ranked #7 in all of baseball for hitting into a double play!!!

So fielding wasnt good or his hitting!!!

[suave1477]

Re: Jeter Not Mvp ?

By accident I answered Staindsox in the qoute - please read their for my responses and that is my point exactly Cjlong

[staindsox]

Re: Jeter Not Mvp ?

An MVP is the most valuable to their team. Morneau was the team leader and put the team before himself. If Jeter did the same thing, he would have backed A-Rod and would also be playing at 3rd. That is why Morneau is the one holding the MVP award.

[cjclong]

Re: Jeter Not Mvp ?

One more thing. Jeter did win a gold glove. You can argue over whether the best fielder always gets the award, but I've never heard of a bad fielder wining one. If fielding is the test how many gold gloves does Morneau have compared to Jeter? I hear a lot of silence. And its a hell of a lot harder to play shortshop than first base. Never hear of anyone moving from first to shorstop do you? So give up on that one.

[suave1477]

Re: Jeter Not Mvp ?

Well to the best of my knowledge the MVP award meant Most valuble player not Most Valuable to the team.

Since Player would be referring to performance on the field.

NOT MVPT - Most Valuable Player & Teamate

Your trying to justify he didn't get the award because he didn't suck up to the media and give Arod PRAISE, I PRAISE Jeter for not coming out of his face and telling the Media what he really thinks of ARod.

Now that's a LEADER!!!

[staindsox]

Re: Jeter Not Mvp ?

The MVP is the most valuable player, the player the most indespensible, the guy his team could not do without. You don't judge an MVP on stats alone. Standing up for a player isn't sucking up to the media, that's what a team player does. Morneau got the team to gel. Jeter could have too. He has the charisma and clubhouse power to squash any kind conflicts like this, but he didn't and let A-Rod go it alone. The 2006 Yankees should have been more and nobody stepped up and fixed this issue.

[cjclong]

Re: Jeter Not Mvp ?

Again, if the test is everybody's buddy how do you explain all of Barry Bonds MVP's . Different test for him and everyone else? Have you ever heard ANY of Jeter's teammates complain about him. Torre has said that players who come to the Yankees from other teams tell him after being there for a while that they are amazed after watching him play that he is even better than they thought. He leads by example. And the Yankees respect him.

[cjclong]

Re: Jeter Not Mvp ?

So Jeter could have fixed ARod. How? ARod has had problems that go back to Texas and beyond. There are lots of guys who can't make it in New York. If a guy has touble there he's got to handle it himself. Tell the fans not to boo. Jeter is New York wise enough to know the fans are going to do what they want to. Jeter is one of the best liked players the Yankees have ever had and the fans were booing him when he had a bad slump a year or two ago. Guess he doesn't deserve the MVP because he not the psychologist who can fix ARods probems, the same ones he's had since he was in Texas, just magnified on the New York stage. Virtually all the Yankees would say Jeter's a great teammate. These attacks are just getting silly.

[staindsox]

Re: Jeter Not Mvp ?

First of all, this isn't an attack. Jeter is tremendous and will be a first ballot Hall of Famer. Torre isn't the manager of that team, Jeter runs it. If he doesn't like someone, they're gone. The only person in my memory who had more power as a player and how this situation compares is Cal Ripken... and Jeter may even surpass him in influence. Jeter didn't stick up for A-Rod. It's easy to see that they don't like each other that much, but they can't say anything either...that would start a war. Instead of Jeter saying that he's not going to tell the fans who they can and cannot boo, he could have said that A-Rod will come around and if we're going to win, he will play a critical role. A lot of what the media gets is posturing anyway. Giambi took shots at A-Rod, I believe Mussina did, Torre alluded to a few things...Jeter has the power and personna to end anyone...including Torre or management, from bashing a teammate. He would have been my MVP if he did this, but the A-Rod issue was allowed to fester and it never really was addressed once and for all. Jeter is tremendous, but I believe he could have dealt with this differently and stopping the sniping from point #1. I am interested to see what happens with A-Rod next year and how the Yankees handle it. Once again, this is a golden opportunity for Jeter to smooth everything over. I think he could and should use his sway to get the team on the same page and work together. If they do, they will be the team to beat.