Ichiro Suzuki Baseball Future

[danesei@yahoo.com]

Re: Ichiro Suzuki Baseball Future

I was at the final Jeter game and mentioned to my wife that it might end up being Ichiro's last game as well...

Now that he has a contract in hand with the Marlins, you can assure your wife that won't be the case.

[danesei@yahoo.com]

Re: Ichiro Suzuki Baseball Future

I really hope he doesn't re-sign with the Yankees. It's not anything against the Yankees, per se, but rather a realization that his playing time will be highly diminished on that team. Maybe he'll sign with Tampa.

[BRONXBOMBERS1]

Re: Ichiro Suzuki Baseball Future

Latest!!! Yankees are considering signing Ichiro before Baltimore does this will be a wise move for the Yankees considering that Ichiro is still a big draw and name and as discussed before come through if he is in the roster this upcoming year he will be close too his 3000 hit mark and his stolen bases record as well considering he stays healthy I'm sure if he comes close he will be welcomed back in 2016 as well so that another Yankee holds the 3000 hit record legitimately!!!
Happy New Year!!!

[BRONXBOMBERS1]

Re: Ichiro Suzuki Baseball Future

Guys I appreciate all the discussion in regards to this tread I started for the future of Ichiro I am really glad that I'm not the only one out there that feels this great player deserves his due let him finish his out his career get his records after all look what all he has given us and still continues to give us everytime he enters the field at 41 the guy is awesome!!
Happy Holidays to all who responded to this blog and thanks!!
Regards
Sal bronxbombers1

[Roady]

Re: Ichiro Suzuki Baseball Future

You win. Merry Christmas!

[danesei@yahoo.com]

Re: Ichiro Suzuki Baseball Future

So 8 in the 90's. Less than one per year.
Bottom line is like so much in baseball there is much conjecture and no way of knowing.
I think he is one of the best contact hitters I have ever seen not to mention his fielding and base running. I have said many times he was a much better player than Jeter.
I have nothing but respect for his game and how he played it.
But he didn't start his career in mlb so what he would have done or when he would have been called up is nothing but guesses.

Once again, you're trying to use a non-analogous situation to make your case. I said assume Suzuki started his career in his AGE 20 season (the year when he turned 21) of 1994. I assumed he played half his team's games that year and 3/4 of the games the following year.

You keep trying to make a point of the number of 19-yr-olds who made their MLB debut in the 90s, but the scenario called for Suzuki to start his MLB career at 20. So, although you insist on making the point that eight players made their MLB debuts at 19 or younger in the 1990s, the fact remains that 50 (FIFTY) players made their debut at the age of 20 or younger in the 1990s.

As for being inclusive for 70 years, far from it. Just because Branch Rickey allowed Jackie Robinson onto his Dodgers team doesn't mean baseball was inclusive. The Red Sox didn't integrate until 1959 due to pressure from the NAACP and a separate lawsuit filed against Tom Yawkey and Bucky Harris for discrimination in the form of barring black employees (players and executives) from the Red Sox.

Baseball has a history of discrimination, as do most professional sports, in America. That's fact, not opinion.

[Roady]

Re: Ichiro Suzuki Baseball Future

And I seriously doubt his "ethnicity" would have held him back. Baseball at least for the last 70 years is as inclusive and welcoming as any business in existence. If you can play you will get your shot.
We shouldnt look for racism that isnt there.

[Roady]

Re: Ichiro Suzuki Baseball Future

So 8 in the 90's. Less than one per year.
Bottom line is like so much in baseball there is much conjecture and no way of knowing.
I think he is one of the best contact hitters I have ever seen not to mention his fielding and base running. I have said many times he was a much better player than Jeter.
I have nothing but respect for his game and how he played it.
But he didn't start his career in mlb so what he would have done or when he would have been called up is nothing but guesses.

[danesei@yahoo.com]

Re: Ichiro Suzuki Baseball Future

1994-2000: 1290 hits
2001-pres: 2844 hits

The modeling I used showed Suzuki's first season as 1994. He would have been 20 in that year. I didn't even have him playing a full season at age 20 in MLB. I had him playing half the season that year. If he starts at age 19 instead of age 20, that would likely add 140+ hits to the pre-2001 total. In fact, Suzuki turned 21 shortly after the end of the 1994 season, so I really think he would have been called up by mid-1994, assuming there was no bias against his style of hitting nor ethnicity.

For what it's worth, there were 50 players called up at age 20 or younger in the 90s, or five per season. I don't think it would be a stretch for a team that somehow had Suzuki in their minor league system batting .320 to at least get a look.

Name all of the players who played their first MLB games at age 19 during the 90's.

But since you asked (1990-1999 debut season, grouped by age):

18 (1):
Alex Rodriguez

19 (7):
Adrian Beltre
Rich Garces
Karim Garcia
Andruw Jones
Aramis Ramirez
Ivan Rodriguez
Todd van Poppel

20 (42):
Rick Ankiel
Steve Avery
Dee Brown
Mike Caruso
Luis Castillo
Roger Cedeno
Eric Chavez
Wilfredo Cordero
Gookie Dawkins
Jeff D'Amico
Lance Dickson
Hector Fajardo
Alex Fernandez
Cliff Floyd
Benji Gil
Alex Gonzalez
Shawn Green
Willie Greene
Jose Guillen
Johnny Guzman
Mike Hampton
Todd Hundley
Derek Jeter
Jeff Juden
Byung-Hyun Kim
Gene Kingsale
Brent Knackert
Pedro Martinez
Gil Meche
Ramon Morel
Marc Newfield
Melvin Nieves
Chan Ho Park
Edgar Renteria
Dennys Reyes
Matt Riley
Jeff Suppan
Julian Tavarez
Ismael Valdez
Vernon Wells
Kerry Wood
Esteban Yan

[Wrigley2010]

Re: Ichiro Suzuki Baseball Future

That being said, I think Ichiro's debut season made it clear he was more than ready to hit in mlb. How he would have been at 20, 21, 22 is anyone's guess. I personally think he'd be flirting with 4000. Truly an awesome career, I hope he hangs it up sooner than later. Watching a .230 Ichiro would be sad.

I too believe if Ichiro had started his career in the Majors we would be saying his name in sentences with the likes of Rose and Cobb. I feel privileged to say I got to watch his entire MLB career playout and hope the last few years are dignified ones.

[Roady]

Re: Ichiro Suzuki Baseball Future

That being said, I think Ichiro's debut season made it clear he was more than ready to hit in mlb. How he would have been at 20, 21, 22 is anyone's guess. I personally think he'd be flirting with 4000. Truly an awesome career, I hope he hangs it up sooner than later. Watching a .230 Ichiro would be sad.

I agree.
Too many former good or great hitters hang on or are given that one last chance by a desperate club. Players don't retire with dignity like, Ted Williams did. anymore. The money may be a factor these days though.

Re: Ichiro Suzuki Baseball Future

That being said, I think Ichiro's debut season made it clear he was more than ready to hit in mlb. How he would have been at 20, 21, 22 is anyone's guess. I personally think he'd be flirting with 4000. Truly an awesome career, I hope he hangs it up sooner than later. Watching a .230 Ichiro would be sad.

Re: Ichiro Suzuki Baseball Future

http://www.baseball-reference.com/blog/archives/9995

[Roady]

Re: Ichiro Suzuki Baseball Future

Name all of the players who played their first MLB games at age 19 during the 90's.

[danesei@yahoo.com]

Re: Ichiro Suzuki Baseball Future

He would have been lucky to start at 20 or 21 and most likely would have spent time in the minors as most do and had his first full season at 22 or 23. Also his BA has never been as good in MLB as it was in Japan.
So he probably would not be as close as most think he would.

Assuming he wasn't absurdly held back in high-A for a completely unorthodox approach to hitting, he would have made his MLB debut at 19 or 20. Remember, Suzuki would have been coming up in the 90s, when players would regularly move up a full level (none of this weird, six levels of MiLB) per season, sometimes two levels. If he were remotely as successful in MLB as he was in NPB (meaning .280 as opposed to .350), he would have had 1200 hits over his age 20-26 seasons. 170 hits a season is all it would take. I highly doubt he wouldn't be able to post those numbers, given he absolutely destroyed that standard during his time with Seattle. Even accounting for some sort of bias against style holding him back until age 22, he would have five full seasons to add to his total. Let's assume Suzuki pre-27 was somehow only capable of averaging 190 hits per season, that puts him at 3800 for his career. 4000 hits would definitely be within reach. Now, let's be somewhat more realistic and actually track his year by year probables:

1994 - 90 hits (I think this is a safe assumption, given Eric Anthony had 79 games in LF, while batting an abysmal .237)
1995 - 160 hits (with Griffey hurt and an aging Vince Coleman taking actual reps, I could see Suzuki batting leadoff at least 100 games and playing some role in 120 games)
1996 - 185 hits in his first truly full time season
1997 - 210 hits
1998 - 220 hits
1999 - 215 hits
2000 - 210 hits

1994-2000: 1290 hits
2001-pres: 2844 hits
Hypothetical all US career for Suzuki: 4134 hits through age-40 season
123 hits shy of being the "all time hit king" at that point, I could see Suzuki not only breaking Rose's record, but possibly holding on through age-45 in pursuit of 4500 hits for his career. If he managed to beat that pace and get to 4680 by age 46, he might even stick around to get to 5000 hits.

If this were the 70s (or maybe even the 80s), I could see an argument against Suzuki getting much playing time, due to racism in the league among other reasons, but given he started with the Mariners and a progressive league that we have today, I doubt any manager would hold him back just to ensure the record remained in the name of a US born player.