ARODS Bush League Moment Again lol lol

[3arod13]

Re: ARODS Bush League Moment Again lol lol

The best shortstop in baseball...maybe ever (and i have a hard time saying that because i love honus wagner) is playing third base. If Jeter were that great, he would have moved. Hell, Hank Greenberg moved to left field for Rudy York to play first.

What about Cal Ripken? There was a huge whole on his side of the infield and he was hitting .220 at the end. The manager's couldn't manage because Cal actually ran the team. The Orioles may have been better off if Cal had ended the streak much earlier.

Babe Ruth, the most popular athlete ever? Well...read Creamer's book on him.

My point is that no athlete is the perfect role model. Anyone, no matter how perfect they appear, have their flaws. Yes, I've heard bad things about Cal Ripken, Michael Jordan, Wayne Gretzky...they are far more stable than the Albert Belles and Michael Vicks. I think you have to be overly confident and pretty self-absorbed to get as good as they are. Some just hide it better than others. These guys played sunrise to sunset every day when they were kids. Everything is second to their career. That is selfish in itself...but that's how they became superstars.

For example, I grew up loving Paul Molitor and Kirby Puckett. Everyone thought they were two of the greatest people in the game. Well, Kirby...everyone knows that story now. Paul did cocaine in the early 1980s, impregnanted a woman who was not his wife while playing for the Blue Jays, divorced, and is having a third child with another woman (I think he married her after his divorce went through). I don't think differently of them. They were my heroes and they were very kind to me when I met them. See, my heroes are flawed too.

I'm not writing to tear down other people's heroes. My point is that everyone has their flaws, even if you can't see them...even the Jeters and Ripkens. I think everyone needs to consider this before bashing a player because of a marital problem or "Hah." Anyone responding to this post defending Jeter, Ripken, or Ruth completely missed the point of what I'm saying.

Chris

Chris, well said! Bravo! Bravo! My point all a long. Those actions by players of course aren't good, but I'm more interested in baseball! Well said!

[metsbats]

Re: ARODS Bush League Moment Again lol lol

http://sports.aol.com/mlb/story/_a/torre-denounces-a-rods-shout-at-fielder/20070601185409990001?cid=561

This may be off topic now the way this thread has directed itself.

Interesting enough both Joe Torre and Brian Cashman are unfortunately in positions to potentially lose their jobs. More on Joe Torre's side however he was big enough to admit ARod was wrong and Cashman didn't think it was.

Just shows that even in the face of adversity Torre will stand behind his beliefs.

I'd personally love to know what The Boss thought of the "yell".

-David

[allstarsplus]

Re: ARODS Bush League Moment Again lol lol

Just shows that even in the face of adversity Torre will stand behind his beliefs.

Managers should discipline behind closed doors. Shouldn't he stand behind his players in public? I love how Torre will criticize ARod, but when a real blatant incident of unsportsmanlike behavior happens like possibly ending a player's career from a beanball he says NOTHING. His pitcher throws a ball at a batter's face----no apologies at his press conference. For anyone who didn't see last nights Red Sox/Yankees games there was 5 hit batters and then in the 9th inning Scott Proctor threw a fastball towards the face of Kevin Youkilis who is the Red Sox hottest batter. Youkilis barely pulled away and got grazed on the shoulder. The umpire swiftly ejected Proctor and the benches cleared with no punches thrown.

Here's what Torre said in his news conference. Read between the lines because I am sure there will be more ejections this weekend. "I think we need to be a little more fiery," said Joe Torre. "I think we showed fight tonight. We need to assert ourselves ... just get that determination back," Torre said. "I hope we can build on this because we're good. We're much better than we've been playing, but obviously the results haven't shown."

No mention of not condoning beanballs. Interesting. He didn't have to say a word about ARod in public, but decided to while the night before on ESPN former Manager Dusty Baker says the jeers from players go on all the time and the ARod incident was no big deal which has been reiterated by many that play the game.

Yes what ARod did was unsportsmanlike but unsportsmanlike acts go on all the time---unfortunately. Throwing a fastball near the head region of any batter could end a career and is a cowardly act of the highest level of unsportsmanlike conduct.

Torre ought to worry more about winning.

Andrew

[metsbats]

Re: ARODS Bush League Moment Again lol lol

I agree with you that a pitcher throwing at a hitter is most un-sportsman like. However baseball has actually in my opinion become desensitized to this behavior because it's come so common an occurence and an accepted part of the game. Roger Clemens and Pedro Martinez come to mind as pitchers who are guilty of head hunting.

So the "Yell" took everyone by surprise.

And you are absolutely correct Andrew about the double standard because I didn't recall Torre denouncing Clemens during the 2000 season and WS after he almost killed Mike Piazza during that regular season game at Yankee Stadium or during the 2000 WS when Clemens threw that bat barrel towards Piazza.

David

[David]

Re: ARODS Bush League Moment Again lol lol

I was watching the Yankees Red Sox Games and, talking about Arod's "Hey," Joe Morgan said similar things would be said to him when he was trying to catch a fly. For example, base runners would go in front of him and say "How you doing, Joe?" when he was fielding. Joe said he didn't think twice about these and other distraction techniques at the time, as they were part of the game, and thinks there are so many 'unwritten rules' today that no one can possible know them all. Infielder Johny Pesky said similar distraction stuff happened to him all the time in the 1940s-50s.

Morgan pointed out one unwritten rule which he thought typified today's unwritten and often arbitrary rules. He said, if you're ahead 10-0, the leading team is not supposed to try and steal a base because it will show up the opponents. However, the leading players still try and hit home runs.

[David]

Re: ARODS Bush League Moment Again lol lol

I should add that, as a former infielder at the butt of many attempted distractions, Morgan said he didn't see anything wrong with what ARod did. And I suspect that Pesky wouldn't either.

[Nathan]

Re: ARODS Bush League Moment Again lol lol

I should add that, as a former infielder at the butt of many attempted distractions, Morgan said he didn't see anything wrong with what ARod did. And I suspect that Pesky wouldn't either.

Although I'd love to use it because it proves my point, I reject what Joe Morgan has to say on the grounds that he's both a buffoon and a blowhard. I have a difficult time seeing how someone who played the game so well and so smart can be such a moron in the booth. He's as bad as what Tim McCarver has degenerated into.

[cjclong]

Re: ARODS Bush League Moment Again lol lol

In regard to ARod and "clutch hitting." Last night ARod's 9th inning homerun beat Boston off a quality closer.( And from the replay he hit a tough two strike pitch) On the day of the controversy about ARod yelling at the 3rd baseman he had hit a single to put the Yankees ahead late in the game. In an earlier post I said that ARod wasn't among the top clutch hitters I've seen. But when a batter, say David Ortiz, has a reputation as a clutch hitter in late innings we remember when he succeeds and tend to forget when he fails. With Arod we remember when he fails and seem to forget when he succeeds. As I said, there are a number of players I'd rather have up in crucial late inning situation, but in fairness to him he's not the complete bum he is sometimes made out to be.

[suave1477]

Re: ARODS Bush League Moment Again lol lol

cjclong I can appreciate what your saying and you right to an extent of sometimes we do forget when he does come through, but there is only one problem. That those moments are so few and far between that his once or twice out of whole season doesn't exactly give me the warm and fuzzies. lol lol

It becomes almost like when he does come through in a clutch situation - your response is more like "ok thats nice" becuz even if he helps you win 1 game how many did he cost you, to win that 1 game.

I don't mean to seem like an AROD Basher as I really do feel he is a superior player but dam he aggravates the crap out of me.
Like I said before i was excited when AROD was like a Monster in April, but then again that's AROD being AROD he is hot in April and then its so long see ya for the rest of the year.

[cjclong]

Re: ARODS Bush League Moment Again lol lol

Suave, I also appreciate what you are saying. When ARod was with Texas I saw him play a number of games both in person and on televison and I've seen him on a number of Yankee telecasts and a few in person. While he was with Texas I became aware after a while he seemed to be making an awful lot of outs in the late innings. I know I would rather have Jeter up with a game on the line, but I have no statistical reason I can site, just a feeling. Does anyone keep stats, baseball seems to have a stat for everything, that can be used to measure clutch hitting? I know there is a stat on game winning hits, but you never see it. And I suppose even that could be misleading. For a player of ARod's talent it seems there ought to be better production in the late innings, but this year he has gotten a fair number of big hits as he's done this last week even while slumping in average and I just wonder how what he's done over the last few years in late innings compares to other players. I guess one reason I'm questioning is that when Jeter doesn't get a big hit I tend to forget it because of his past big hit history and when ARod makes an out I remember it for the same reason.