Innocent until proven guilty

[David]

Re: Innocent until proven guilty

I respect your opinion and posts on the matter.

[JasonM33]

Re: Innocent until proven guilty

As I said before. I would prefer that no one ever took steroids. But, since they did and the problem is beyond repair I think we should just accept it. That's my opinion. Also, I'm dissapointed to have my opinion dismissed as being just because I like Jose Canseco. No hard feelings though. To each his own.

-Jason M

[David]

Re: Innocent until proven guilty

I agree that real baseball is played without aluminum bats.

However, I also believe that real baseball is played without steroids and human growth hormone.

One reason I dislike steroids et al, is that the enjoyment (for me, at least) of watching a track race is to see who is the fastest human, not to see which runner takes the most effective illegal drugs. If everything is about performance, then they might as well scratch the humans and insert cars and greyhounds. If the Olympics were truely about the fastest, strongest and most agile, no human would be entered. Your 7 year old, slightly over weight tabby cat can perform better on the parallel bar than any human Olympic Gold Medalist. Your neighbor's pet whippet would win the 100, 200 and 400 meters. The horse at the local farm would win the marathon, mile, long jump and (naturally) 3000 steeplechase without getting winded. A pair of Cal Tech grad students could devise a robot to win the pole vault with no need for the pole. If all that matters about baseball is performance and the excitement of the long ball, they might as well insert robots for players and use aluminum bats and rubber balls.

This helps explain why, to me, artificially enhancing performance doesn't make a sport better. It makes it worse. Seeing a horse run fast can be enjoyable and we're all aware that horses are faster than humans over a two mile race. However, that does not mean inserting a horse into a human two mile foot race makes the human foot race better. After the race, which the horse finished in about 1/3 the time as the second place finisher, spectators will remark that the race was about the most pointless and stupid spectacle they've witnessed.

[JasonM33]

Re: Innocent until proven guilty

LOL

Again, I'm not advocating steroid use. I'm just stating what I believe to be a fact. I think everyone has a right to their own opinion and no one is wrong.

-Jason M

[3arod13]

Re: Innocent until proven guilty

Acutally, not according to your thinking. Maybe steroids will help (lol)

Didn't see you already said that. I guess I can only assume you LOVE jose canceso so much, that you'll defend steriods.

I can't honest believe you think it's a good thing.

[3arod13]

Re: Innocent until proven guilty

Also, I don't think aluminum bats would raise their overall level of play. If the guy is slow he's still going to be slow. Aluminum bat's aren't going to help anyone steal bases or throw people out. Steroids on the other hand.......

Acutally, not according to your thinking. Maybe steroids will help (lol)

[3arod13]

Re: Innocent until proven guilty

Deadly serious. For me personally, I would rather that no one in pro sports ever took steroids. I feel this way because steroids have warped one of the most important parts of the game. Statistics and all-time records. With all of the steroid drama it's impossible to know who took them and when they were taking them. It screwed the whole thing up beyond repair.

However,

I do believe that steroid using players are better than their non juiced counterparts. They are able to do things that normal players can't do. Specifically I'm refering to the modern player that can combine home run power with the footspeed to steal bases at the same time. Also, older players are able to perform at a high level for much longer than they otherwise could. Look at Barry Bonds and Roger Clemens. So, yes I believe that they bring a better product to the field.

-Jason M

Wow! Unbelieveable!

[JasonM33]

Re: Innocent until proven guilty

Also, I don't think aluminum bats would raise their overall level of play. If the guy is slow he's still going to be slow. Aluminum bat's aren't going to help anyone steal bases or throw people out. Steroids on the other hand.......

[JasonM33]

Re: Innocent until proven guilty

I understand what you are saying but I don't even acknowledge aluminum bats. Real baseball is played with wood bats. I can't stand that rediculous plink sound they make when they hit the ball. That's why I don't watch college baseball. I'd rather just pretend that it doesn't exist. As a matter of fact I'd rather watch people play wiffle ball.

-Jason M

[David]

Re: Innocent until proven guilty

But that is an argument for giving players aluminum bats. If you give Craig Biggio an aluminum bat, he'd triple his home runs, raise his batting average significantly and get to 3,000 hits as fast as lightening. However, I don't know of any serious baseball fan who would consider giving Craig Biggio an aluminum bat an improvement on the game, even though it would raise his level of play significantly from old man levels. Most, including Biggio himself, would consider the achievements from his new aluminum bat to be a joke.

[JasonM33]

Re: Innocent until proven guilty

What? Are you serious about this remark? That's suppose to be a good thing? It's cheating! I care about a better product based on working out and natural ability.

Deadly serious. For me personally, I would rather that no one in pro sports ever took steroids. I feel this way because steroids have warped one of the most important parts of the game. Statistics and all-time records. With all of the steroid drama it's impossible to know who took them and when they were taking them. It screwed the whole thing up beyond repair.

However,

I do believe that steroid using players are better than their non juiced counterparts. They are able to do things that normal players can't do. Specifically I'm refering to the modern player that can combine home run power with the footspeed to steal bases at the same time. Also, older players are able to perform at a high level for much longer than they otherwise could. Look at Barry Bonds and Roger Clemens. So, yes I believe that they bring a better product to the field.

-Jason M

[David]

Re: Innocent until proven guilty

My view on baseball players and steroids is, if steroids didn't help baseball players wouldn't take them. And if baseball players didn't think taking steroids was wrong, they wouldn't deny taking them (Remember, players would deny taking steroids even when it wasn't against the rules and there was no punishment).

My last rhetorical question would be, would MLB be better if players used aluminum bats? That would definitely produce more home runs and runs.

[3arod13]

Re: Innocent until proven guilty

Professional athletes use performance enhancing drugs, and they deliver a better product on the field because of it.

-Jason

What? Are you serious about this remark? That's suppose to be a good thing? It's cheating! I care about a better product based on working out and natural ability.

[JasonM33]

Re: Innocent until proven guilty

I respect your opinion but I think we should just shrug our shoulders and accept reality. Professional athletes use performance enhancing drugs, and they deliver a better product on the field because of it.

-Jason

[David]

Re: Innocent until proven guilty

I should add that Ken Caminiti was black balled by many players. Do you know why? Because had the gall to talk publicly about his personal steroid use.