Another Lampson Gem!

[trsent]

Re: Another Lampson Gem!

Is it possible to attach audio to your posts? If so, I think we need to attach a siren to Joels. I'm sorry, but its getting old, what did the seller say?, did you email your concerns?, what did lou say?, and so on. If you don't like the job that the people that run this site are doing, let them know (which I know you have done several times). If you dont like their response or lack of response to the situation, dont visit the site anymore. I believe in rules too, but seriously man, let the mods do their job. Again, I'm sorry, but enough is enough!

-Chris

Chris - The moderators do not monitor each thread. My concerns are genuine, and Howard didn't follow the rules thus not giving the seller a chance to reply to his concerns.

Why are there rules if they are ignored time and time and time again?

If you don't like the rules, go to a forum with no rules.

In fact, a couple of weeks ago I emailed the four moderators with my concerns about 10-15 posts on the forum. They didn't act on any except for Chris Cavalier making one giant post attached to the top of the forum. I guess that was his reply.

I'm with Joel on this one, seems like lately there have been too many "Sherlock Holmes" wanta-be's on here (no one in particular) calling out people and items for sale. Nothing wrong with that as long as you are 100% sure of what you are claiming, no room for opinions when trashing someone...having said that, as per "FORUM RULES" before trashing someone and or their items, CONTACT THEM FIRST. You may be surprised and get a valid explanation on why ... they may not know the problem with their item in which case you would have done your job in pointing it out and they would have the opportunity to address the issue. It may just be an honest person with no malicious intent unaware of the problem... Makes sense don't ya think? Administration is not always available right away to monitor as they have been very busy with their new ventures (Platinum marketing, Forum Store, etc) No problem in pointing out the rules. Just my humble opinion..

George

George, thank you for stepping in. These guys hang people, want them given a lethal injection before they even followed the simple rules of asking before questioning.

When Joel seriously asked if the poster tried to reach the unreachable Mr. Lampson, he pretty much undermined his point. I suggest if Joel feels a rule is being violated that he report the post involved to the actual mods instead of playing vigilante mod.

I am sorry, I will post when I want to - Who make you God to determine who can or cannot contact Lou Lampson? I offered 3 people he could have contacted and you look for a loophole that means the rules can be broken and no one can comment about it?

The rules were broken and I asked why.

I'm sure that Lampson or Vintage Authentics can be reached, if not sooner, later. But reachable or not, that is the protocol as established by the administrators of this forum, contact the people in question "before" you post....it's not a "feeling" Joel has, it's the rules.

George

George, can Vintage be reached? Sure. But Mr. Lampson? You must know better than that.

While Joel is accurate, as you are, as to the rule, I think it's his persistent obsession with playin' vigilante Sheriff here that's causing some backlash. As I said, if he wants to report a violation to the mods fine, but stop playing mod.

I reported violations to the Mods - Why don't you contact them and stay out of my business.

As for Lou Lampson, when I used to be on speaking terms with American Memorabilia they told me they can reach him anytime so someone can contact him - Why do you make such a big deal over my 3 options - Did Howard Wolf contact at least the seller before calling his merchandise questionable?

Did he? I know he didn't - So I ask you - Why can't I ask why the rules were ignored? Who made you a higher power - BLOCK MY POSTS IF YOU DO NOT LIKE THEM BUT LAY OFF OR CONTACT THE MODERATORS AND COMPLAIN ABOUT ME YOURSELF.

WHAT THE HECK IS YOUR PROBLEM - There are problems ignored and you attack me for my concerns - WHAT DID I DO BUT ASK MY CONCERNS?

Again - Stop wasting other's time - You are wrong and if you want, contact the moderators about my posts yourself but do not tell me what I can or cannot post.

Why do you think Joel is trying to play a role of a vigilante sheriff? Because he chooses to obide by the rules of the forum? It's unfortunate that these rules are seldom enforced and many members know that, allowing them to post their opinions here before even questioning the seller. Maybe Joel is just interested in hearing the auction house's or Ebay lister's answer to their inquiry? Which is why he asks what their reply was. Don't you think that would make interesting and educational reading here? Nobody has seen every one of Griffey's gamers to say that they all had an extra length tag. It's very common, but certainly not concrete. To state otherwise would be irresponsible. I'm not indicating that you should agree with me, rather just look at it from this perspective.

Amen - I appreciate people for once making it clear they are concerned why the rules are ignored time and time again.

[aeneas01]

Re: Another Lampson Gem!

Maybe Joel is just interested in hearing the auction house's or Ebay lister's answer to their inquiry? Which is why he asks what their reply was. Don't you think that would make interesting and educational reading here?

i had no idea joel might have so much interest in hearing a seller's response to questioned items - if this is the case, and given he's already forced to spend so much time reminding forum members of the rules, perhaps he would be interested in a type of forum liaison role. if a member finds an item suspect, an email would be sent to joel and joel would then contact the seller. if within 24 hours the forum member hasn't heard back from joel, then the post is made.

this would work well for me because i don't find the responses from seller's that peddle garbage interesting or educational in the least. in fact i find the responses quite redundant and would be happy to hand it off to someone that may find it so intriguing. if joel really finds the process interesting and educational, enjoys what might be gained, then let me be the first in line to cast my vote for joel as forum liaison!

i don't know about other members, but when i contact sellers that pitch junk i'm usually lied to - here's a response i once got from an ebayer, an experienced vintage helmet collector. i noticed that he was selling a couple of helmets that he had purchased on ebay the previous year, but this time around he had offered a completely different story. posing as an inexperienced collector, i asked him about the helmets...

-------------------------

Good Morning XXXXX:

I got these two helmets at the same time and from the same person. I lived in Houston, Texas from 1993 to 1998. Back in 1995 I met a gentleman (John Rutherford) down there who owned one of the biggest Sports Bars in Houston. He and I became pretty good friends mainly because we both shared an enormous interest in vintage sports memorabilia. He was more partial to baseball and I was a football man. In any case, his Sports Bar was full of past and current memorabilia - so much so that he didn't even have the space to display everything that he had. These two items were in storage along with an enormous amount of other stuff that he either had collected or had given to him. I know that he said that many of the game used items that he had were donated to the Sports Bar either by players or collectors who frequented his place. I would doubt that the actual players who wore these helmets had given these to him due to these items being as old as they are. I never asked him where they came from, I just knew that they were authentic as soon as I saw them. So I have had these helmets for about 12 years now and I have decided to sell them to focus on my collection of Vintage Big 8, Big 7 and Big 6 Conference stuff. I just can't collect everything! That is pretty much the story on these two helmets. I wish that I could tell you more about them, but I have never put much stock into the certificates of authenticity or anything unless the item is coming directly from the team or player. I could submit these items to those authenticators from Grey Flannel or those other auction houses and would have no doubt that they would authenticate them as the real thing, but I just don't see the point in paying someone to tell me what I already know. :-) Do you know what I mean?

Thnaks for your interest!

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when i contacted him to tell him he was full of shat, that i knew exactly where the helmets came from and what they were (not authentic), he responded with:

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I will tell you what buddy.........you have now started something that I am going to finish. Good luck to you and all your future auctions!

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here's a response i got from an ebayer that was trying to sell a bogus troy aikman gamer that has made the rounds - apparently someone pointed him to this forum, to a post i had made about it in the past. anyway it's clear that he didn't realize i was "robert"....

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With all due respect, I took Huggins and Scott up on their offer and had it professionally evaluated. It passed with no questions whatsover. Moreover, the "expert" on that forum (Robert) states that the jaw pad rivets are "typically" painted. Yes they are, unless the jaw pad rivets are replaced. The jaw pad rivets are brand new.

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replaced jaw pad rivets? good grief! here's a response i received from a guy that listed a leon lett dallas cowboys "gamer" - the thing is, it was the exact same helmet that sold on ebay a couple of months earlier as a mccormack helmet. not only was the dymo tape on the back of the helmet changed from "mccormack" to "lett", but the attention to detail in making the "lett" tape look worn and haggered was simply amazing - it really gave you an idea of how far some will go to rip off buyers...

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I contacted the dealer whom sold me the helmet aand he said he would give my money back. I'm sorry but I can't give his name because I don't feel right about it. All I can say is his store is neer my house but I don't know the exact adress or phone number.

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here's an ebayer that takes modern helmets, removes the vinyl padding, and adds his own home-made suspension units to them - he then slaps easy-to-buy nfl decals on them and lists them as vintage, authentic, game-used helmets. the funny thing is his home-made suspension units are so bad, so goofy (he even hand writes the helmet size on the suspension with magic marker, then smears it, thinking that it will look like a faded factory size stamp!). anyway here is his response when i asked him about his "authentic" helmets....

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Thank you for your return message. When it comes to the stitching at not that I don't know. All I'm saying is I did not put the suspensions in the helmets. These guys your talking about also seem to try to give the impression that I made these suspension helmets from scratch. The helmets are painted and decaled exactly of that era, the helmets were not made just yesterday and were made in the 60's -70's, they are not modern made suspensions and that's also what I say in the listing. And are in great conditon that's all I say and nothing more then that. These so called experts are making a bigger deal out of it then what's there. Anyway thanks again for your interest take care.

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and this is just the tiny tip of the iceberg - i have a ton of this type of correspondence on file. so if joel or anyone else wants to contact sellers on the forum's behalf, i'm in...

....

[mvandor]

Re: Another Lampson Gem!

I am sorry, I will post when I want to - Who make you God to determine who can or cannot contact Lou Lampson? I offered 3 people he could have contacted and you look for a loophole that means the rules can be broken and no one can comment about it?

I reported violations to the Mods - Why don't you contact them and stay out of my business.

Did he? I know he didn't - So I ask you - Why can't I ask why the rules were ignored? Who made you a higher power - BLOCK MY POSTS IF YOU DO NOT LIKE THEM BUT LAY OFF OR CONTACT THE MODERATORS AND COMPLAIN ABOUT ME YOURSELF.

WHAT THE HECK IS YOUR PROBLEM - There are problems ignored and you attack me for my concerns - WHAT DID I DO BUT ASK MY CONCERNS?

Again - Stop wasting other's time - You are wrong and if you want, contact the moderators about my posts yourself but do not tell me what I can or cannot post.

Call a spade a spade. This is about an ongoing tiff between you and Howard, little more.

As to your meltdown with me, I'll simply let your words speak for themselves, you don't hurt me when you go off like that you just hurt yourself in the eyes of the forum. Post away amigo.

[trsent]

Re: Another Lampson Gem!

I am sorry you feel this way. I always respected you, but your crying over my questioning is out of line and I do not care how you view it - Two supporters who I do not know came on and said my question is valid as the forum is being abused.

As for that helmet guy giving a stupid post above - FOLLOW THE RULES AND EMAIL A SELLER BEFORE ASKING A QUESTION AND DO NOT ASSUME I HAVE ANY ISSUES WITH HOWARD WOLF BECAUSE I DO NOT!

He didn't email the seller. I contacted the seller and asked if he was emailed prior to the post being made and he told me he has not received any emails about the jersey from Howard Wolf.

Why is this acceptable?

[earlywynnfan]

Re: Another Lampson Gem!

Joel, I'm glad to see you've become a stickler for following the rules, that will help much in other situations here.

For example, a few months ago, two members got into a verbal sparring match, each baiting each other and each calling each other names. Now, as you know, this is clearly against the rules! This happened on a couple different threads. So the peacemaker in me jumped in and said "Hey guys, this is getting ugly, how about cooling it for a while?" One of the members replied back with a very sarcastic "why don't you formally apply for the job of moderator, since that seems to be what you want to do."

Remember that, Joel?

Ken
earlywynnfan5@hotmail.com

[mvandor]

Re: Another Lampson Gem!

I am sorry you feel this way. I always respected you, but your crying over my questioning is out of line and I do not care how you view it - Two supporters who I do not know came on and said my question is valid as the forum is being abused.

As for that helmet guy giving a stupid post above - FOLLOW THE RULES AND EMAIL A SELLER BEFORE ASKING A QUESTION AND DO NOT ASSUME I HAVE ANY ISSUES WITH HOWARD WOLF BECAUSE I DO NOT!

He didn't email the seller. I contacted the seller and asked if he was emailed prior to the post being made and he told me he has not received any emails about the jersey from Howard Wolf.

Why is this acceptable?

Did I ever say it was "acceptable"? No, I said it really isn't your place as just a regular forum member to CONTINUALLY beat on people on this issue, which you do when you're not defending the indefensible from auction houses. The shtick has grown tiresome so I spoke up.

[trsent]

Re: Another Lampson Gem!

Joel, I'm glad to see you've become a stickler for following the rules, that will help much in other situations here.

For example, a few months ago, two members got into a verbal sparring match, each baiting each other and each calling each other names. Now, as you know, this is clearly against the rules! This happened on a couple different threads. So the peacemaker in me jumped in and said "Hey guys, this is getting ugly, how about cooling it for a while?" One of the members replied back with a very sarcastic "why don't you formally apply for the job of moderator, since that seems to be what you want to do."

Remember that, Joel?

Ken
earlywynnfan5@hotmail.com

Ken, every time I have an issue, you chime in, why?

I love it - When someone breaks the rules and I bring it up - I get attacked by weak people who do not understand the concept of fair play.

I call out an issue with this thread, and you bring up something I did wrong in the past? What does that have to do with this situation?

I just received a phone call from the seller of the Ken Griffey, Jr. jersey. He made it clear that Howard Wolf never emailed him his question.

Now I ask the moderators - Why is this allowed, time and time again?

I know - GUU is now a business and an auction house, but Chris Cavalier just made a post about calling out items and a few days later it is ignored and the same bunch of people tell me I am out of line, but eBay seller masauction was never emailed about the concerns and everyone ignores this fact because they want to call me a "spade" - What does this mean? I believe it is a raciest comment from my past dealings with this expression but what do I know.

So, find issues with me and let the forum be a WITCH HUNT where sellers are attacked without being contacted over concerns and then when someone asks why the rules are allowed to be broken - Attack that person because we like people to abuse the system because we are better than the questioner....

Oh wait - I am stopping here. I need to get some sleep. So silly - Attack the person for questioning a proper issue because we cannot accept that Joel Alpert is correct for a change.

Good luck and may your god be with you.

[aeneas01]

Re: Another Lampson Gem!

As for that helmet guy giving a stupid post above - FOLLOW THE RULES AND EMAIL A SELLER BEFORE ASKING A QUESTION AND DO NOT ASSUME I HAVE ANY ISSUES WITH HOWARD WOLF BECAUSE I DO NOT!

hey sport, i'm assuming you are referring to me as "that helmet guy" given i collect vintage helmets... if so, please explain why you think i assumed you have issues with howard based on my "stupid post". go slowly tho, explain as you would a small child....

...

[trsent]

Re: Another Lampson Gem!

Did I ever say it was "acceptable"? No, I said it really isn't your place as just a regular forum member to CONTINUALLY beat on people on this issue, which you do when you're not defending the indefensible from auction houses. The shtick has grown tiresome so I spoke up.

Ok, so why do you continue - You are wrong here for harassing me.

I am right, so say you are sorry for harassing me for asking a question that I have a right to ask and move on. I have no issues with you as before this mess you always seems like an upright citizen but harassing me over a question that I do not have to explain why I asked is out of line and excessive now.

[otismalibu]

Re: Another Lampson Gem!

Robert,

I think the board cancer is going to come back with something about you and your god. Just a hunch.

[mvandor]

Re: Another Lampson Gem!

Ok, so why do you continue - You are wrong here for harassing me.

I am right, so say you are sorry for harassing me for asking a question that I have a right to ask and move on. I have no issues with you as before this mess you always seems like an upright citizen but harassing me over a question that I do not have to explain why I asked is out of line and excessive now.

No apology, I stand by my comments. If you played this card once, fine, but the volume of your work shows an obsession over this issue to the point you're virtually playing mod by lecturing people incessantly over it.

Clearly, this thread is becoming far too personal and is starting to scream for a lockdown.

[trsent]

Re: Another Lampson Gem!

hey sport, i'm assuming you are referring to me as "that helmet guy" given i collect vintage helmets... if so, please explain why you think i assumed you have issues with howard based on my "stupid post". go slowly tho, explain as you would a small child....

...

Sorry, your post was stupid because you told us how all sellers are liars and crooks and you made the point that sellers should not have to be emailed first with concerns since they are all liars and crooks.

Did I understand your concerns better, now? Please continue with the Witch Hunt and allow people to abuse the system day after day after day after day (imagine Dr. Cox from Scrubs here)

Sorry for the confusion. I am tired.

[trsent]

Re: Another Lampson Gem!

No apology, I stand by my comments. If you played this card once, fine, but the volume of your work shows an obsession over this issue to the point you're virtually playing mod by lecturing people incessantly over it.

Clearly, this thread is becoming far too personal and is starting to scream for a lockdown.

Yes, lock-down the thread and let people abuse the system time and time again and attack the questioner and let people abuse the system and cop out with the theory of locking the thread.

You owe me an apology for attacking me on the forum when my concerns were genuine..

My points are valid -

CHRIS CAVALIER - I EMAILED YOU, ERIC AND MIKE - WHY IS HOWARD WOLF ALLOWED TO ABUSE THE SYSTEM AND I HAVE TO TAKE THE HEAT FOR QUESTIONING IT?

Is the more to this than meets the eye?

[otismalibu]

Re: Another Lampson Gem!

Let's try out some auction house rules for posting. Anyone can post anything, whether it's based on fact or fantasy. Then, after a week or so, the post can quietly be deleted if enough people complain about it.

Then the mods can spin it with, "In our ongoing quest to give you the best GU message board experience, we've deleted a few posts. We're not saying the posts were wrong, but the content needs additional research."

Like someone else said - just see what sticks.

[aeneas01]

Re: Another Lampson Gem!

Sorry, your post was stupid because you told us how all sellers are liars and crooks and you made the point that sellers should not have to be emailed first with concerns since they are all liars and crooks.

Did I understand your concerns better, now? Please continue with the Witch Hunt and allow people to abuse the system day after day after day after day (imagine Dr. Cox from Scrubs here)

Sorry for the confusion. I am tired.

so let me see if i've got this straight - you wrongly accuse me of assuming that you have issues with howard when i never accused you of any such thing, and for good measure you refer to my opinion as "stupid"? and you're the guy concerned about forum rules? you might want to consider a forum rules refresher course sport, perhaps you can start with these...

03. no personal attacks.

04. no advertising.

07. no trolling or baiting.

12. no topic changing.

16. (your favorite). "in instances where a forum member is identifying an item in the hobby they believe to have issues, it is expected that the poster clearly state their findings in the form of an opinion and provide adequate rationale for why they believe there is an issue. when possible, it is expected that the poster questioning an item will attempt to contact the seller of the item and allow at least 24 hours for the seller to reply before posting."

http://www.gameuseduniverse.com/vb_forum/showthread.php?t=99

btw if you're at all confused as to why i selected the above rules as a starting point for you, please let me know and i will be more than happy to elaborate. as far as your favorite rule is concerned (16), for the life of me i can't find anything there that states it's mandatory for a member contact a seller before posting, that it's mandatory for a member to wait 24 hours for a response.

...