Grey Flannel Auction on ebay ......

[LHG39]

Re: Grey Flannel Auction on ebay ......

So your claim is that Grey Flannel is intentionally selling this item misrepresented trying to defraud the public? You claim they are trying to take advantage of the uninformed, so I would think you are claiming they know the error and want to admit it.

I just figured if you could offer some evidence it would help the claim so maybe I can help you have the item pulled if evidence is shown to back up your claim.

I would challenge GF to show me one picture of the mets wearing a Blue batting pratice jersey any time circa 1973. Shouldn't the onus be on them to show that this is a 1973 ish BP jersey. I have no recollection nor did I ever see the Mets wear a BP jersey prior to approximately 1981. If they did, then someone show a picture confirming it.

Perhaps the deception is not intentional. Maybe their thinking is "we got it from a reliable source, it looks authentic, Willie only played for the Mets in 1972 and 1973, so it must be circa 1973"

Maybe it is not intentional deception, but they certainly did no research on this one. Ask any Met fan around about this one.

[LHG39]

Re: Grey Flannel Auction on ebay ......

This is about the best source on Mets jerseys out there. It confirms my 1981 claim.

http://www.ultimatemets.com/uniforms.html

[nate]

Re: Grey Flannel Auction on ebay ......


1981 style


1982 style


picture from spring 75

Was there another blue jersey in 75?

[LHG39]

Re: Grey Flannel Auction on ebay ......

[ATTACH]1920[/ATTACH]
1981 style

[ATTACH]1921[/ATTACH]
1982 style

[ATTACH]1922[/ATTACH]
picture from spring 75

Was there another blue jersey in 75?

You cannot go by dates in Getty Images. They are notoriously inaccurate, especially for older images. Do you really think those images of Kingman are from Jan 1 1975 and Jan 1 1978? He wan't even traded to the Mets until Feb 1975. I am fairly certain that is really a picture from 1981.

[Eric]

Re: Grey Flannel Auction on ebay ......

Kingman played for the Mets in 75, 76, part of 77, 81, 82 and 83.

[trsent]

Re: Grey Flannel Auction on ebay ......

Usually, when a picture is dated January 1, 19XX on Getty, it is from that general era of that season. This is really becoming too much ado about nothing that has been proved to be in error except for personal opinions, which do not justify pulling the lot.

I understand the theory may be right, but proof is needed to back it up, not just views. Don't say "I challenge you, Grey Flannel, to photo-match the item." They won't help you there.

You brought up the issue, and you have to prove it wrong.

Then again, if you don't like it, don't buy it, right?

[both-teams-played-hard]

Re: Grey Flannel Auction on ebay ......

This is really becoming too much ado about nothing

Much "ado" about nothing? Joel that's your M.O.

Don't play the "don't like it-don't buy it" card...if that is your logic, then this forum ceases to exist. Did you see the photo I posted of Willie in pinstripes taking BP? Getty's dates are OFTEN wrong by years, not just days. The Mets didn't use Batting practice jerseys before 1981. THE FREAKING END.

[trsent]

Re: Grey Flannel Auction on ebay ......

Much "ado" about nothing? Joel that's your M.O.

Don't play the "don't like it-don't buy it" card...if that is your logic, then this forum ceases to exist. Did you see the photo I posted of Willie in pinstripes taking BP? Getty's dates are OFTEN wrong by years, not just days. The Mets didn't use Batting practice jerseys before 1981. THE FREAKING END.

Ok, so did you email Grey Flannel (who is traveling this weekend) to tell them to correct this item? I was asking for proof, but it doesn't appear to exist.

[kingjammy24]

Re: Grey Flannel Auction on ebay ......

if it helps any, bill henderson's guide states "1981 is the first year that the Mets are issued team BP jerseys". what a funny coincidence that several people who've studied mets jerseys all seem to be listing the exact same year.

rudy.

[hblakewolf]

Re: Grey Flannel Auction on ebay ......

BTPH-
Fantastic Homework, to say the least! You have clearly demonstrated that Willie was taking BP in a game jersey, as should be the case. The Mets began using BP's in 1981, 8 years after the BP in question could have been used.

Regardless of your facts, you wil continue to deal with those individuals on this Forum that will defend the major auction houses and large companies to their deaths, even when confronted with information such as yours. These folks have a deep vested interest, as they consign items and feel they can't afford to burn bridges or future sales. Some may call it good business, however, most call it simply spineless and pathetic.

Howard Wolf
hblakewolf@patmedia.net

[LHG39]

Re: Grey Flannel Auction on ebay ......

I am glad to see that many seem to agree with me on this one. My take is this, shoudln't GF have to be able to substantiate, to at least some degree, that this jersey is circa 1973? Why is the onus on me to disprive them, when I have limited resources other than my knowledge? How about they get a letter from the Mets? They are a pretty big operation, they should be able to do that if the jersey is legit, no? Currently they have no proff whatsoever and this jersey will likely go for several thousand dollars.

[CollectGU]

Re: Grey Flannel Auction on ebay ......

Howard,

That is hypocritical of you. when I confronted you about the Jeter Mizuno glove that you sold through Mastro, and asked you to provide some type of photo evidence that showed Jeter used a Mizuno glove in Japan, which I am convinced does not exist, you simply said to contact Dave Bushing and Mastro as you were told by them that he did. So, it's OK to question an item BUT not if it's your item which you sold for over $10,000.....

[CollectGU]

Re: Grey Flannel Auction on ebay ......

BTPH-

Regardless of your facts, you wil continue to deal with those individuals on this Forum that will defend the major auction houses and large companies to their deaths, even when confronted with information such as yours. These folks have a deep vested interest, as they consign items and feel they can't afford to burn bridges or future sales. Some may call it good business, however, most call it simply spineless and pathetic.

Howard Wolf
hblakewolf@patmedia.net

Howard,

That is hypocritical of you. when I confronted you about the Jeter Mizuno glove that you sold through Mastro, and asked you to provide some type of photo evidence that showed Jeter used a Mizuno glove in Japan, which I am convinced does not exist, you simply said to contact Dave Bushing and Mastro as you were told by them that he did. So, it's OK to question an item BUT not if it's your item which you sold for over $10,000.....

[TNTtoys]

Re: Grey Flannel Auction on ebay ......

The Mets used this blue knit as an alternate style game jersey in 1982, 1983, and 1984.

This is what I have learned in my research...

The Mets did not use this style as an alternate in 1982, 1983 and 1984. The batting practice jersey was often confused with the alternate blue. The differentiation was that the alternate blue game jersey had a blue stripe, the batting practice had a white stripe. Further, the alternate jersey was used only 1 year - 1982. Mitchell and Ness is selling a "1983 Seaver blue alternate" however, the year on this jersey is wrong. They sometimes get the year wrong...
The BP jersey with the orange-white-orange triple stripe did not originate until circa 1983-1984. In 1982-1983, the Mets wore a BP jersey with "NY" on the left chest. There were 2 versions of this jersey -- one with orange NY and one with silver NY. Again, Mitchell and Ness got it wrong with this jersey. They sell a "1984 Darryl Strawberry NY BP jersey" but by 1984, this jersey was not in production.

[LHG39]

Re: Grey Flannel Auction on ebay ......

This is what I have learned in my research...

The Mets did not use this style as an alternate in 1982, 1983 and 1984. The batting practice jersey was often confused with the alternate blue. The differentiation was that the alternate blue game jersey had a blue stripe, the batting practice had a white stripe. Further, the alternate jersey was used only 1 year - 1982. Mitchell and Ness is selling a "1983 Seaver blue alternate" however, the year on this jersey is wrong. They sometimes get the year wrong...
The BP jersey with the orange-white-orange triple stripe did not originate until circa 1983-1984. In 1982-1983, the Mets wore a BP jersey with "NY" on the left chest. There were 2 versions of this jersey -- one with orange NY and one with silver NY. Again, Mitchell and Ness got it wrong with this jersey. They sell a "1984 Darryl Strawberry NY BP jersey" but by 1984, this jersey was not in production.

You are incorrect. The Mets did wear that style in 1983. See the 2 Topps cards from the 1983 Topps traded sets. The Mets did wear these jerseys in 1983 (Seaver was not with them in 1982) and as you point out the BP jersey had the NY logo so these must be alts.