Pedro Martinez - the new Michael Vick

[joelsabi]

Re: Pedro Martinez - the new Michael Vick

Dude
What is your obession with giving cockfighters the benefit of the doubt? The Dominican Republic is a third world country. They're still learning. Giv'em a few years to catch up with the rest of the civilized world. Washington and Jefferson never learned the difference between right and wrong, then they died and their bodies turned to dust. I don't know much about the laws of the Dominican Republic....but, slavery is illegal there, right?

i am not obsessed. i just dont think it is newsworthy. its also not like culture is morally progressive. maybe the dominicans will illegalize boiling live lobster before we do.

[both-teams-played-hard]

Re: Pedro Martinez - the new Michael Vick

Apparently there is a tv show hosted by former Twin Kent Hrbek who *gasp* hooks fish with sharp wires and kills birds and animals.

Pedro appearing at a chickenfight is about as newsworthy as Britney Spears going to the hospital. Chickenfighting is legal and generally accepted in the the DR. They don't care if you like it or not. It isn't your business. Things like abortions are legal in this country. Which is worse. Letting two chickens duke it out or shoving a sharp object through the head of an unborn baby. I don't like abortions but I won't sit here and judge someone who got one. I won't call them a coward.

I am not saying you don't have the right to be disappointed with Pedro supporting that activity. But judging him is premature without first understanding the role the activity plays in the culture. I know we as Americans certainly don't appreciate the radical Muslims judging us for what is accepted in our culture.

As far as people doing things in the past that were legal which are illegal now, yep it happens and it is based on changing opinions over time. I am fully convinced that in 100 years from now people will look back on us with disgust for driving gas guzzling heavy vehicles with big v8 engines that "destroyed" the environment.

These are all good points. They make for an interesting debate. These are all opinions, so everyone is right. I think the animal lovers of this forum (myself included) just spoke with their hearts. I was given a shotgun on my 12th birthday. I went with my dad and grandfather, and shot a squirrel. I've gone duck hunting and dove hunting. But I grew up and realized I had more sense. I didn't keep hunting cause it was part of my culture. I picked up a fishing rod before I picked up a football or baseball bat. I still think fishing is cool. But what angler tortures fish? My family practices the "catch and release" concept of fishing. The information given about Washington and Jefferson is not opinion....it is fact.

[XPFO]

Re: Pedro Martinez - the new Michael Vick

Not only is cock-fighting a part of the culture in the Dominican but it is widely accepted through most parts of Central and south America as well as Mexico. Several years back, I attended a cock fight while on an excursion in Mexico. We went and explored the more traditional side of Mexican culture including the cock-fights and luchador fights. they have stadiums built to hold upwards of a thousand people just to see the cock-fighting event. I am not saying I condone it, but every culture has things that are frowned upon in other societys. China and Korea, eating dogs is common place, here it is seen as disgusting. We have abortion, other religions and culture think that is murder.

I don't think it is right for us to judge another societies beliefs. It might not be politically correct where you come from, but to some societies it is common place.

And FYI, if you ever want to speak of inhumane torture of chickens...on a recent business call to a plant that processes chickens for chicken wieners, I was far more disgusted with the way Chickens were treated and "disposed" of then I was attending the cock-fights, but this is accepted in our culture...why is that?? Because they are being processed for food? Tell that to the chicken.

[sylbry]

Re: Pedro Martinez - the new Michael Vick

Apparently there is a tv show hosted by former Twin Kent Hrbek who *gasp* hooks fish with sharp wires and kills birds and animals.

Pedro appearing at a chickenfight is about as newsworthy as Britney Spears going to the hospital. Chickenfighting is legal and generally accepted in the the DR. They don't care if you like it or not. It isn't your business. Things like abortions are legal in this country. Which is worse. Letting two chickens duke it out or shoving a sharp object through the head of an unborn baby. I don't like abortions but I won't sit here and judge someone who got one. I won't call them a coward.

I am not saying you don't have the right to be disappointed with Pedro supporting that activity. But judging him is premature without first understanding the role the activity plays in the culture. I know we as Americans certainly don't appreciate the radical Muslims judging us for what is accepted in our culture.

As far as people doing things in the past that were legal which are illegal now, yep it happens and it is based on changing opinions over time. I am fully convinced that in 100 years from now people will look back on us with disgust for driving gas guzzling heavy vehicles with big v8 engines that "destroyed" the environment.

[kingjammy24]

Re: Pedro Martinez - the new Michael Vick

FYI George Washington and Thomas Jefferson participated in cockfighting.

thomas jefferson also owned 187 slaves and believed in segregation. at the same time, he was also a hypocrite who fathered out-of-wedlock bi-racial children with a concubine. washington owned 317 slaves. if your point is that both men had severely flawed sides, then i agree. apparently, their enjoyment of cockfighting was one of their flaws.

during the time of slavery in the US, it was not only legal but also acceptable. during that time, there were also those who, despite the laws and culture at the time, clearly had the common sense and moral compass to know it wasn't right. today, any thinking person looks back and knows it wasn't right or acceptable.

at some point in the future, i imagine the DR will follow a similar path and look back this disgusting part of its cultural history with regret and embarassment. washington went from having no moral reservations about slavery to eventually realizing it was wrong. everyone wakes up at different times.

rudy.

[camarokids]

Re: Pedro Martinez - the new Michael Vick

Hey Pedro , at least the Roman Emperors and Gladiators would be proud of you and your Dominican Culture....

but this is the 21st Century.....

I for one do not see the where the joy comes from in watching an animal or person fighting to the death .....

[rose14]

Re: Pedro Martinez - the new Michael Vick

I don't care who does it or has done it in the past. They are all cowards in my book. Anyone that takes joy in particpating or watching whether a past president or not is scum in my book. Those people have no respect for any living creature.

[suave1477]

Re: Pedro Martinez - the new Michael Vick

Are you saying every person in the Dominican Republic fights chickens? It is inhumane, regardless of some so-called culture. I don't need to respect any culture that is cruel to animals. I said people who breed and raise animals for the purpose of watching them fight to their death are sociopaths and psychopaths. If the whole country fights roosters, then the whole country is indeed, psychopaths. On Christmas morning...does a Dominican family awake to fight their birds? Do they give gifts of sharp new blades to attatch to their roosters' legs? Then, watch the rooster blood fly? If that's culture...I don't want any of it.

Both teams I read this this and was hysterical laughing your too much man lol lol

[both-teams-played-hard]

Re: Pedro Martinez - the new Michael Vick

FYI George Washington and Thomas Jefferson participated in cockfighting.

Dude
What is your obession with giving cockfighters the benefit of the doubt? The Dominican Republic is a third world country. They're still learning. Giv'em a few years to catch up with the rest of the civilized world. Washington and Jefferson never learned the difference between right and wrong, then they died and their bodies turned to dust. I don't know much about the laws of the Dominican Republic....but, slavery is illegal there, right?

[joelsabi]

Re: Pedro Martinez - the new Michael Vick

Are you saying every person in the Dominican Republic fights chickens? It is inhumane, regardless of some so-called culture. I don't need to respect any culture that is cruel to animals. I said people who breed and raise animals for the purpose of watching them fight to their death are sociopaths and psychopaths. If the whole country fights roosters, then the whole country is indeed, psychopaths. On Christmas morning...does a Dominican family awake to fight their birds? Do they give gifts of sharp new blades to attatch to their roosters' legs? Then, watch the rooster blood fly? If that's culture...I don't want any of it.

i said culture not every person.

[both-teams-played-hard]

Re: Pedro Martinez - the new Michael Vick

I dont think you want to categorize the dominican culture as a culture full of sociopaths and pscho-paths. We need to respect culture differences. i dont see why Mr Martinez is being judged for doing what in his culture is accepted.

Are you saying every person in the Dominican Republic fights chickens? It is inhumane, regardless of some so-called culture. I don't need to respect any culture that is cruel to animals. I said people who breed and raise animals for the purpose of watching them fight to their death are sociopaths and psychopaths. If the whole country fights roosters, then the whole country is indeed, psychopaths. On Christmas morning...does a Dominican family awake to fight their birds? Do they give gifts of sharp new blades to attatch to their roosters' legs? Then, watch the rooster blood fly? If that's culture...I don't want any of it.

[joelsabi]

Re: Pedro Martinez - the new Michael Vick

In my opinion people that take part in dog fighting, cock figting or any other form of fighting involving innocent parties are total cowards.

FYI George Washington and Thomas Jefferson participated in cockfighting.

[suave1477]

Re: Pedro Martinez - the new Michael Vick

Respecting other cultures is one thing!!!

but being inhumane whether it is here in the U.S. or in Dominican republic is still inhumane it is universal no matter where you go.

Just because it is a loowed doesnt make it right.

Just because Pedro feels he can do it in Dominican Republic and can't do it here doesnt mean when he steps off his flight to come into the U.S. his morals change, he still feels its ok to let them fight, he just knows he cant do it here in the U.S.
But its still ok with him and no matter what country your in it still doesnt sit well with me to abuse animals.

[kingjammy24]

Re: Pedro Martinez - the new Michael Vick

1. "hey it's legal so it's ok"

in the 1600s it was legal to own a slave. cockfighting was legal in louisiana until 2007. i guess all the people who felt it was ethical in 2005 did a 180 in 2007 and suddenly felt it wasn't ethical huh? or was it always unethical and louisiana was just late to the party in realizing the obvious? the issue isn't of legality. it's about acting like a decent, civilized human being with a modicum of ethics.

2. "it's part of their culture!"

stoning a person to death for adultery currently enjoys a role in some cultures. anti-semitism was an accepted part of germany's culture in the early 40s. at one point, racism was a commonly accepted and embraced part of american culture.

defending morally reprehensible behavior on the grounds of legality and culture didn't fly in the nuremburg trials either.

as for the nuggets, there's likely a difference between killing an animal to eat it and watching its slow, torturous death simply for some chuckles.

rudy.

[WadeInBmore]

Re: Pedro Martinez - the new Michael Vick

Dave,

Thanks for the article about Roy "I've been hit in the head one too many times and am know incredibly stupid" Jones Jr. Why on earth would you out yourself especially given todays circumstances AND with the government becoming this overbearing force that has taken aim at professional sports. Idiot.

I, too, agree about respecting other cultures and their traditions....and while Pedro does represent a MLB club, he is a role model whether he likes it or not and that his behavior will be seen and viewed as an American and put into whatever context, cultural or not, as the viewing public chooses. Will his next contract be the first to have a "no cock fighting clause"?! ...in the near future no cheating, drinking, and doping clauses...well no cheating and drinking

wade