Hof Induction On Wednesday.who Doyou Want In

[STLHAMMER32]

Re: Hof Induction On Wednesday.who Doyou Want In

UHHHH What??? The best second baseman in the game period in the 90's and it is not even close. Other than the spitting incident, I am not sure how anyone can suggest he is not a HOF'er.

http://sports.espn.go.com/mlb/hof10/...rry&id=4781279

The only argument anyone could have for this guy not only getting in, but being a first ballot guy, is the spitting incident. The umpire whom he spit at has even said he would vote for him if he had the chance. Alomar is a Hall of Famer NOT EVEN CLOSE

[dirtyla2000]

Re: Hof Induction On Wednesday.who Doyou Want In

How does Alomar's spitting incident compare to Raines' headfirst slide so he wouldn't break the cocaine vial in the back pocket of his uniform?

Ken
earlywynnfan5@hotmail.com

HOW does it compare,not at all! Raines had a 2 year addiction that could have destroyed his own life! Alomar disgraced the entire game. After the Alomar aids rumour,you think the ump checked himself out! The guys a pig!

[bronx_burner]

Re: Hof Induction On Wednesday.who Doyou Want In

I think that Alomar will make it this year.

He certainly will get the most support of the new guys. I just don't think it will be enough this year. If I had to guess I'd say he gets 63%. He might get in, bu thats just my guess.

[Manram]

Re: Hof Induction On Wednesday.who Doyou Want In

I don't think any of the top 4 first time candidates (Alomar, Larkin, McGriff, Edgar) will get in this year. It will be interesting to see what kind of support they do get though as the first year vote seems to have a real effect on future totals. I think Dawson gets in this year. I think Blyleven will be real close but may not get in till next year. So I think it will be just be the 1 or 2 long timers getting in.

My personal ballot would be Dawson, Blyleven, Trammell, Raines, Mattingly, McGriff and Larkin.

I think that Alomar will make it this year.

[bronx_burner]

Re: Hof Induction On Wednesday.who Doyou Want In

I don't think any of the top 4 first time candidates (Alomar, Larkin, McGriff, Edgar) will get in this year. It will be interesting to see what kind of support they do get though as the first year vote seems to have a real effect on future totals. I think Dawson gets in this year. I think Blyleven will be real close but may not get in till next year. So I think it will be just be the 1 or 2 long timers getting in.

My personal ballot would be Dawson, Blyleven, Trammell, Raines, Mattingly, McGriff and Larkin.

[Chris78]

Re: Hof Induction On Wednesday.who Doyou Want In

I think both Alomar and Larkin should be first ballot. Dawson I think will be very close and will make it. Blyleven will be close and might make it. This year we may have 3 or 4 people elected.

Chris

[mr.miracle]

Re: Hof Induction On Wednesday.who Doyou Want In

Here is how the ESPN gang voted. They got it right on the first two IMHO, however Bert, Larkin and Big Mac got my vote as well.



HOW ESPN VOTED

* -- first year on ballot
PLAYERBOBRGEHBJEJIJSMKPGTJTKTQVOTES*Roberto AlomarXXX--XXXXXXXX11 (92%)Andre DawsonX--XXXXXXXXXX11 (92%)Bert Blyleven--XXXXXX------XX8 (67%)*Barry LarkinXXX--XXX--X--X--8 (67%)Mark McGwireXXX--XXX------X--7 (58%)Tim RainesXXX--XXX------X--7 (58%)*Edgar Martinez----X--XXXX----X--6 (50%)Jack MorrisX------XXX------XX6 (50%)*Fred McGriff----X--XXX------X--5 (42%)Lee Smith--XX--------XXX----5 (42%)Alan Trammell----X----X----X--X--4 (33%)Dale Murphy------------X--------X2 (17%)Dave Parker----------------X------1 (8%)
THE VOTERS: BO = Buster Olney; BR = Brendan Roberts; GE = Gordon Edes; HB = Howard Bryant; JE = Jerry Crasnick; JI = Jim Caple; JS = Jayson Stark; MK = Michael Knisley; PG = Pedro Gomez; TJ = Tony Jackson; TK = Tim Kurkjian; TQ = T.J. Quinn

[earlywynnfan]

Re: Hof Induction On Wednesday.who Doyou Want In

Blyleven,Dawson, and I hope Raines gets closer,he was truly one of the greatest lead off hitters of all time! NO ALOMAR! I know that hofers have done worse but the spitting and personal life in disaster is just too much! I raised my kids and coached them playing ball and even though they sometimes taunted the opposition, I would have ripped them both a new one if they ever spat on someone,anyone.That goes against everything baseball stands for. I would have preferred a fist fight!

How does Alomar's spitting incident compare to Raines' headfirst slide so he wouldn't break the cocaine vial in the back pocket of his uniform?

Ken
earlywynnfan5@hotmail.com

[earlywynnfan]

Re: Hof Induction On Wednesday.who Doyou Want In

DON MATTINGLY for sure, if Puckett is in so should Donnie, almost identical numbers. Mattingly was one of the best players on the planet during the mid 80's and carried an awful Yankees team on his back. What other 1st baseman could carry his jock during his day?

George

Hmm, if this is true, why'd he only start one All Star Game? I think McGwire, Carew, Rose, Garvey, and even Al Oliver could, uh, carry his jock. If you look at the lineup of the game he DID start, he's probably the 10th best position player there!

And let's be totally honest, Pucketti isn't exactly a world-class HOFer.

Ken
earlywynnfan5@hotmail.com

[mr.miracle]

Re: Hof Induction On Wednesday.who Doyou Want In

And another one. Alomar was not just the best 2nd baseman in the game in the 90's he was one of the top five players at one point in all of baseball.



The First-Timers




Alomar



ROBERTO ALOMAR


There was once a time, in the mid-to-late '90s, when, if you'd asked me to name my favorite player to watch in the whole sport, I'd have answered: Robbie Alomar.
Why? Because he might have been the most creative, most stylish defensive innovator to pass through this game since Ozzie Smith. That's why. Alomar was a guy who made plays no one else made, saw things no one else saw and did it all with a Human Highlight Video flair that leaped off the field at you.
But Roberto Alomar was just as dominant on the other side of the ball. He had a 10-year period (1992 to 2001) in which he LED THE MAJOR LEAGUES in hits. And the three second basemen in history who can match his career numbers (2,724 hits/.300 average/.371 on-base pct./.443 slugging pct.) all started their careers before 1925.
So how anyone could look at Alomar's career and NOT vote for him is a bigger mystery to me than Stonehenge. If the definition of a Hall of Famer is a man who dominated his position for an extended period of time, then think about all this:
Robbie Alomar won more Gold Gloves (10) than any second baseman who ever played. He's the only second baseman in history who ever made 12 All-Star teams in a row. He finished in the top six in five MVP elections. And he and Mike Schmidt are the only two infielders in history with at least 10 Gold Gloves and four Silver Sluggers.
So aside from the disgraceful John Hirschbeck incident, there's no justification -- none -- for leaving Alomar off anyone's ballot. And we've elected players whose careers included worse blemishes than that. If you consider Roberto Alomar's full body of work and look at the entirety of his career, he's a Hall of Famer. Period.

[mr.miracle]

Re: Hof Induction On Wednesday.who Doyou Want In

Realistically: Andre, Smith, Bert.


Alomar?!?! Are you people for real? Come on!! To me that is the ultimate joke.

UHHHH What??? The best second baseman in the game period in the 90's and it is not even close. Other than the spitting incident, I am not sure how anyone can suggest he is not a HOF'er.

http://sports.espn.go.com/mlb/hof10/columns/story?columnist=crasnick_jerry&id=4781279

[JETEFAN]

Re: Hof Induction On Wednesday.who Doyou Want In

DON MATTINGLY for sure, if Puckett is in so should Donnie, almost identical numbers. Mattingly was one of the best players on the planet during the mid 80's and carried an awful Yankees team on his back. What other 1st baseman could carry his jock during his day?

George

[dirtyla2000]

Re: Hof Induction On Wednesday.who Doyou Want In

Blyleven,Dawson, and I hope Raines gets closer,he was truly one of the greatest lead off hitters of all time! NO ALOMAR! I know that hofers have done worse but the spitting and personal life in disaster is just too much! I raised my kids and coached them playing ball and even though they sometimes taunted the opposition, I would have ripped them both a new one if they ever spat on someone,anyone.That goes against everything baseball stands for. I would have preferred a fist fight!

[bigtruck260]

Re: Hof Induction On Wednesday.who Doyou Want In

Topic is who we wanted in and in that case, Dale Murphy all the way. Played with some truly "bleh" Braves teams and was the best player in baseball for a few years. Then he got injured and old.

The stat accumulator debate will rage forever. Spending 20+ years just not being hurt and putting up modest numbers just to get to the magic 300 wins or 500 HRs or 3000 Hits just means you were a mediocre player that was lucky enough to play a childs game for two decades. The Hall of Reasonably good to great players will induct you though because those are the criteria. Like it or not, if you play 30 years and get 100 hits a season, you are a HOFer 5 years later.

It's all subjective anyway. The roles for players have changed as the sport has. Who would have thought watching MLB in 1981 that a natural shortstop would be considered the best all around and offensive player in baseball? Had the Steroid Issue not arisen, who wouldn't have unanimously elected A-Rod 5 years after he retired?

Should we hold players of yesteryear accountable for their lower numbers because today's stars are so much better? Will the cloud of Steroid Use taint players chances because they were suspected?

Or worse, will the 2nd and 3rd tier players be elected simply because they hit .270-389 hrs-2300 hits but naturally?

Murph was a GREAT player and should be there (IMO). Loved watching him as a kid...speed and power, and though you might think those Braves teams were 'bleh" - I love Chambliss, Washington, Horner, Murph, Hubbard, Ramirez, Benedict, Neikro and Garber. He'll always be a sentimental favorite of mine. When I started playing little league, my first glove was an RBG36 Rawlings Murphy model. I still have it.

[harpt]

Re: Hof Induction On Wednesday.who Doyou Want In

I don't know if I would consider a hall call for Alomar an 'ultimate joke'.

I don't think he will get in because of personality issues (Hirschbeck) and the fact he tended to play short stints on multiple teams.

But it's traditionally tough for second basemen to get in the hall even when their careers are played on a single team. If I recall he was selected as an AS more than any other second basemen (tied with Fox), career .300 hitter, over 2700 hits, and was a monster player during his 5 year stint with the Jays, 3 years in Baltimore, and 3 years in Cleveland. Tended to be clutch in his post-season appearances as well. If I managed in the 90's, I would have penciled him in for 2B on my dream team, and I would vote for him now. But that won't happen, unfortunately, more than any other on field accomplishment, people will remember him turning and spitting in an umpire's face.

I am a white guy from the midwest, so maybe it really isn't my place to play the "race-card" here, but do you ever notice that when white people do things like that nobody seems to care? My goodness, are we really saying that Alomar should (or could) be left out of the Hall of Fame because of that incident? Bill Romanowski spit quite a loogy in another guy's face and it barely made Sportscenter. Maybe I am missing something.