Re: Mac admits using steroids...
I neither understand or agree with the argument that McGwire using steroids was only about maintaining his health and putting a halt to his deteriorating body. To say that it didn't help him hit home runs is deceptive and ignorant...
If his health deteriorated in its natural progression (without the aid of steroids), he would have hit dozens fewer home runs. A banged up/ailing body doesn't hit as many home runs as a fully functioning one. If not for the steroids, he would have been on a level playing field with all those who came before him (those who did not have any ability to extend their careers beyond a natural time frame).
If he bowed out when "Father Time" dictated, his career would have been more similar to a Dave Kingman, Boog Powell, Lee May, Frank Howard or Dave Parker (very good players, but none of whom merit HOF consideration).
Longevity is a big reason that many players have earned HOF honors, and this person clearly experienced an unfair advantage. His grandest records and "achievements" were all produced during the late-career time frame in question.
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Re: Mac admits using steroids...
Joe Morgan, a Hall of Famer and the board’s vice chairman, feels bad for players who didn’t use performance enhancers.
I would go a step further. Guys like Albert Pujols, Frank Thomas and Adam Dunn and some others that never used steroids are studs of their era but they are penalized 3 times because there will always be some that still may think they may not be clean because after guys like ARod, many of us have learned not to trust any of these guys from the era.Originally posted by Joe MorganLeave a comment:
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Re: Mac admits using steroids...
This is becoming a media circus now. He admitted to the 'roids and now let's move on. It seems every time another guy talks about PEDs the sports channels and news shows become obsessed with it.
McGwire gave more info and specifics than any other ballplayer that I can remember except Canseco.
Is he being singled out and being made into the Steroid poster boy now?
Based on his college and Rookie production where he was 'roid free, I still feel he was one of the greatest HR hitters in the game if he had never touched steroids, but unfortunately we will never know what his career numbers would have been without PEDs.
A real shame....Leave a comment:
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Re: Mac admits using steroids...
Agree! But give me a break! Cheating has gone on in baseball for a while now (all different types of cheating).
So if this is cheating and they shouldn't go in the Hall of Fame, then the other ways pitchers cheated and other players, etc., should also count when considered for the Hall of Fame.
Cheating is cheating!
Regards, TonyLeave a comment:
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Re: Mac admits using steroids...
meat pitches based on what? Very very little footage is around. He was walked unintentionally 94 times so there were plenty of balls that were not good. Also no one wanted to just give up Hr's and be linked to the records so he saw the best stuff from each pitcher he faced you would assume and he was not hitting them off of terrible pitchers either as a pointed out already.Leave a comment:
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Re: Mac admits using steroids...
OK, I'm a little bit impressed, but the guy got meat pitches all year long.Leave a comment:
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Re: Mac admits using steroids...
Not at all? I will give you the fact that Mantle had a great season but even being the least favorite among the two Maris won back-to-back MVP's. Obviously Mantle was the better of the two but how does that make what Maris did in 61 not impressive?
Regardless of who you hit in front off you still have to hit the Hr's and off course he won't be intentionally walked to get to a dangerous switch hitter that you cannot play a matchup game with. Maris hit his Homers off very good pitching he hit 36 of his homers off guys who won at least 10 games during the 1961 season. He faced the pressure of actually breaking the record and being hated by media and rooted against by many fans.
To end this I will quote Mickey himself who said, "what Roger did was the most impressive thing I ever saw on a baseball field"......Leave a comment:
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Re: Mac admits using steroids...
What Maris did doesn't impress me very much at all. He is the luckiest guy in the world to bat in front of Mickey Mantle in his prime. He was intentionally walked zero (0) times in 1961 and got tons of balls to swing at.
Mantle's 54 hr's under far different pitching circumstances is far more impressive and underappreciated.Leave a comment:
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Re: Mac admits using steroids...
Between Mark, Dan, and his steriod using, body-building brother Jay, family conversations around the dinner table must be interesting.
Attached FilesLeave a comment:
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Re: Mac admits using steroids...
Lol it just goes on and on! Really I think knowleadgeable baseball fans understand that the game has changed and keep things in perspective. I love the history of the game and learning about the greats that played the game.
For instance think about just the medicinal side of sports that has changed. Things like Tommy John surgery and Knee reconstructions many times serious injuries would just end a career... now guys are not only able to come back and play sometimes they are back within a year now! Even things like cleats that are made to support your feet and take stress off your joints...rather than leather and a little cardboard lol.
One thing today's players deal with more and more is the media..the internet has changed things and more and more a player's personal life is open for public discussion. Can you imagine Mickey and other yankees going out and causing the havoc they did today?Leave a comment:
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Re: Mac admits using steroids...
Two other opinions:
Hank Aaron on Mark McGwire's mea culpa:
"I think that it's wonderful that he did this. It takes a big man to admit this and I want to commend him for that. A lot of people make mistakes, and for him to stand up and admit what he has done in the past, I think it's very admirable.
"As far as I'm concerned he has asked for forgiveness. He has my forgiveness. If that's all that stands in the way between him being inducted into Cooperstown we should all forgive him. He didn't commit murder. He didn't commit robbery. He said he took steroids."
McGwire offered a personal apology to Roger Maris' widow too. While the family still understandably thinks that Roger should have the record, check out their response:
"He told her he had something to tell her - he just wanted her to know the news was going to break and that he did do steroids," Rich Maris said. "He apologized to her, to my dad, to us kids. That speaks volumes to the kind of guy he is . . . My mom was very touched by his call. She felt sorry for Mark - that he's going through this. She conveyed that we all make mistakes and move on from there."
"This [McGwire's steroid use] is something we thought all along. It wasn't so much a surprise, but I feel bad for Mark. He's a very genuine guy and we're close to him - we love him like a brother. I'm glad he got it out."Leave a comment:
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Re: Mac admits using steroids...
What Maris did was incredible. There was a reason why nobody approached it for almost 40 years. I will never forget that HR race I think at the time it was what baseball needed but now we can all look back on the records with our own views which is how the game is I suppose.
On a sidenote many would argue the record still belongs to the Babe because of the games played....
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Re: Mac admits using steroids...
It may not belong to Mark but he was the first one to break it anf got the most hoopla over it because it took so long to break and it was hoopla over a tainted breaking. Yes the record on paper belongs to Bonds but as the other member posted.
In my heart it still belongs to Maris!!!Leave a comment:
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