Radtke Sports, Gridiron Authentics...

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  • aeneas01
    Senior Member
    • May 2007
    • 1128

    #16
    Re: Radtke Sports, Gridiron Authentics...

    speaking of email exchanges with ebayers that sell game used, game worn or game issued equipment, i've recently had this exchange with ebayer dalcowbill (who is known to sell game used dallas cowboys equipment) regarding a "game used drew pearson helmet" he currently has listed.

    for the record, i've stated before on this forum that his goods have always appeared to be authentic and that he struck me as an honest dealer - however i was disappointed some time ago when he listed on ebay a vintage cowboys' suspension helmet, a helmet that i had watched previously sell at another auction house, without including a photo of a severe crack it had sustained. given the many photos he did include of the helmet in his ad, the omission struck me as rather glaring...

    me:

    hello - are you sure this helmet belonged to drew pearson? it's my understanding that pearson only wore a riddell suspension helmet throughout his career - even in the last game of his career, a 12/83 playoff loss to the rams. even the photo you have included in your ad shows pearson wearing a suspension helmet...



    dalcowbill:

    pretty sure- i had lampson look at it for me- he wouldn't write a letter on it because of the clips- they should be grey. the reason they are not is because when the helmet out of storage the grey clips were all cracked so i replaced them with these clips on the helmet.

    me:

    that's odd - i've seen many, many game used helmets earn loa's despite having replacement clips. i mean it's pretty common knowledge among collectors that the vintage gray schutt clips become brittle with age and fall apart - as such, it's not uncommon to see modern replacement clips on vintage game used helmets with coas. but as far as your pearson helmet is concerned, he simply didn't wear anything other than a ridddell suspension during his career - here's a photo of him wearing his suspension in the last game he ever played...

    dalcowbill:

    no respone to email

    me:

    so you are saying lampson authenticated the helmet itself - agreed or stated that it was a pearson game used helmet, but didn't issue any paper because of the clips?

    dalcowbill:

    no respone to email

    me:

    i forgot to add that imo your helmet does appear to be an authentic dallas cowboys' helmet - so i hope you don't think i'm questioning that. also, fwiw, many receivers from that era didn't switch from their suspension helmets to the more modern riddell helmets as they became available because the newer helmets were considerably heavier - and the last thing a fleet-footed receiver wanted was something that could potentially slow him down.

    dalcowbill:

    no respone to email
    robert

    Comment

    • mvandor
      Banned
      • Apr 2007
      • 1032

      #17
      Re: Radtke Sports, Gridiron Authentics...

      My compliments on your wording and approach.

      The last email to Joe didn't necessarily invite a response, so perhaps he won't reply further. I did email him this thread and invited his reply here, but that was a week or so ago. His replies to you are unfortunately a bit less than direct, they seem to imply that he gets these from a reconditioning company that knocks off a few extras or something, however, I was of the impression decals were added by team equipment staff, not reconditioners, so I'm still confused as to how these helmets come about such as his Brady's. Certainly Joe doesn't seem to claim team origination, so something doesn't add up to me.

      Don't know the other seller, but silence in such an exchange is seldom a positive sign.

      Comment

      • mvandor
        Banned
        • Apr 2007
        • 1032

        #18
        Re: Radtke Sports, Gridiron Authentics...

        It appears Joe at Gridiron Authentics is carrying on without any adjustment in how he represents his "game issue" helmets. See http://cgi.ebay.com/TOM-BRADY-2001-P...QQcmdZViewItem

        Same appears true for Radtke:



        It appears money talks louder than this board or their customers.

        Comment

        • radtke
          Member
          • Mar 2006
          • 31

          #19
          Re: Radtke Sports, Gridiron Authentics...

          Originally posted by mvandor
          It appears Joe at Gridiron Authentics is carrying on without any adjustment in how he represents his "game issue" helmets. See http://cgi.ebay.com/TOM-BRADY-2001-P...QQcmdZViewItem

          Same appears true for Radtke:



          It appears money talks louder than this board or their customers.
          No, it was accidentally listed that way. Andale had it stored that way in its database and we re-listed it on accident without checking. Sorry for the confusion.

          Comment

          • mvandor
            Banned
            • Apr 2007
            • 1032

            #20
            Re: Radtke Sports, Gridiron Authentics...

            Originally posted by radtke
            No, it was accidentally listed that way. Andale had it stored that way in its database and we re-listed it on accident without checking. Sorry for the confusion.
            Rick, as a regular customer of yours, I appreciate you caring enough to monitor this forum and respect the feelings of its members - serious collectors. I look forward to your correction of your Andale template.

            Comment

            • aeneas01
              Senior Member
              • May 2007
              • 1128

              #21
              Re: Radtke Sports, Gridiron Authentics...

              yeah, mvandor, i noticed the same thing - but it looks like radtke has ended the auction per the mistake. btw, what's the deal - are radtke and ga the same outfit? are they related in any way? i mean what are the odds that they would describe their favre helmets (as i mentioned at the beginning of this thread) in the exact same manner - verbatim..

              any comment rick?


              radtke sports:

              "...many unique game features include: packer's custom pearl-metallic "packer gold" paint, usa tribute flag, clear warning decal..."
              http://cgi.ebay.com/BRETT-FAVRE-AUTO...QQcmdZViewItem

              gridiron authentics:

              "...many unique game features include: packer's custom pearl-metallic "packer gold" paint.... usa tribute flag..."
              http://cgi.ebay.com/BRETT-FAVRE-AUTO...QQcmdZViewItem
              robert

              Comment

              • mvandor
                Banned
                • Apr 2007
                • 1032

                #22
                Re: Radtke Sports, Gridiron Authentics...

                Originally posted by aeneas01
                are radtke and ga the same outfit?
                I do not believe that they are related in any way, not even based in the same area of the country as I recall. I suspect one copied the other's content in an effort to expedite the ebay listing process, no more...

                Comment

                • radtke
                  Member
                  • Mar 2006
                  • 31

                  #23
                  Re: Radtke Sports, Gridiron Authentics...

                  Originally posted by aeneas01
                  yeah, mvandor, i noticed the same thing - but it looks like radtke has ended the auction per the mistake. btw, what's the deal - are radtke and ga the same outfit? are they related in any way? i mean what are the odds that they would describe their favre helmets (as i mentioned at the beginning of this thread) in the exact same manner - verbatim..

                  any comment rick?


                  radtke sports:

                  "...many unique game features include: packer's custom pearl-metallic "packer gold" paint, usa tribute flag, clear warning decal..."
                  http://cgi.ebay.com/BRETT-FAVRE-AUTO...QQcmdZViewItem

                  gridiron authentics:

                  "...many unique game features include: packer's custom pearl-metallic "packer gold" paint.... usa tribute flag..."
                  http://cgi.ebay.com/BRETT-FAVRE-AUTO...QQcmdZViewItem
                  There is no relation between us. We are two seperate companies. Gridiron copied the listing.

                  Comment

                  • aeneas01
                    Senior Member
                    • May 2007
                    • 1128

                    #24
                    Re: Radtke Sports, Gridiron Authentics...

                    thanks for the reply rick -

                    have you ever contacted ga and said "stop palgiarizing"? i mean they've been doing this for quite a long time, copying your descriptions...
                    robert

                    Comment

                    • radtke
                      Member
                      • Mar 2006
                      • 31

                      #25
                      Re: Radtke Sports, Gridiron Authentics...

                      Originally posted by aeneas01
                      thanks for the reply rick -

                      have you ever contacted ga and said "stop palgiarizing"? i mean they've been doing this for quite a long time, copying your descriptions...
                      Unfortunately,

                      It is impossible to police everyone on Ebay. If we could do that, Ebay would be a much better place. Thanks for the heads up.

                      Comment

                      • aeneas01
                        Senior Member
                        • May 2007
                        • 1128

                        #26
                        Re: Radtke Sports, Gridiron Authentics...

                        Originally posted by aeneas01
                        gridiron authentics not only has a "game issue" favre helmet listed on ebay but now also has a "tom brady 2001 patriots game issue helmet" with a starting price of $985. ga descibes the brady listing as a "...tom brady new england patriots game issue helmet from the 2001 season and specifically the game against the Jets... helmet is extremely rare. it is not a home-made or 'rigged' piece..."

                        this item description is more than laughable especially given that this offering is exactly what ga says it's not - "a home-made... rigged piece..." the facemask is incorrect, the chinstrap is incorrect and the patriot side decals aren't even close to being positioned correctly - many seasoned ebay helmet reproducers have offered much more accurate brady reproductions in the past without the "game issue" nonsense and the hefty price tag. apparently gridiron authentics feels the 911 memorial decal they've included adds about $800 to the worth of this weak reproduction.
                        well, after not getting too many (or any?) bites it looks like ga decided that listing its "tom brady 2001 game issue helmet" on ebay with a starting price of $985 wasn't going to pay the rent. so they went ahead and relisted this "extremely rare" gem with a starting price of $10 and no reserve. 11 bids later they finally fetched $318 for the thing...

                        robert

                        Comment

                        • mvandor
                          Banned
                          • Apr 2007
                          • 1032

                          #27
                          Re: Radtke Sports, Gridiron Authentics...

                          Off season is generally a bad time to sell NFL stuff on ebay in my experience, good time to buy though. But it's great it went for an appropriate value, perhaps this board is being seen by more people and having more of a positive influence than I previously believed.

                          Unfortunately Joe hasn't cleaned up his "game issue" descriptions so far as I can tell, nor responded to the thread (I emailed him) so I presume he's decided to ignore GUU and his more knowledgeable customers unlike Rick Radtke.

                          Comment

                          • mvandor
                            Banned
                            • Apr 2007
                            • 1032

                            #28
                            Re: Radtke Sports, Gridiron Authentics...

                            aeneas01, check out http://cgi.ebay.com/Tom-Brady-F-S-Ga...QQcmdZViewItem.

                            Gridiron Authentics actually provided LOA's with the unsigned Brady helmets. Amazing.

                            They were one of my two fav sellers on ebay (Rick Radtke being the other). I spent thousands with Joe, but this whole "game issue" thing with GA is really hurting my previously held very high opinion of he and his firm. Just not an honest representation.

                            As to his representations to me that neither he nor his staff added anything to the helmets, that they're sold as he received them, and his comments to you that they were sourced from the reconditioners...

                            Do reconditioners apply stickers? I thought they just verified safety and repainted the shells?

                            Comment

                            • aeneas01
                              Senior Member
                              • May 2007
                              • 1128

                              #29
                              Re: Radtke Sports, Gridiron Authentics...

                              Originally posted by radtke
                              Unfortunately, It is impossible to police everyone on Ebay. If we could do that, Ebay would be a much better place. Thanks for the heads up.
                              interesting - i would have thought a business competitor such as ga with similar items as yours and a whopping 14,000 ebay sales might have come to your attention before now....

                              Originally posted by mvandor
                              aeneas01, check out http://cgi.ebay.com/Tom-Brady-F-S-Ga...QQcmdZViewItem.

                              Gridiron Authentics actually provided LOA's with the unsigned Brady helmets. Amazing.
                              beautiful...

                              Originally posted by mvandor
                              They were one of my two fav sellers on ebay (Rick Radtke being the other). I spent thousands with Joe, but this whole "game issue" thing with GA is really hurting my previously held very high opinion of he and his firm. Just not an honest representation.
                              no, it's not an honest representation mvandor - as i've mentioned before, imo there's only one reason to claim a helmet is a "game issue" piece of equipment when it isn't, and one reason only - to intentionally attempt to inflate the value of a reproduction.

                              Originally posted by mvandor
                              As to his representations to me that neither he nor his staff added anything to the helmets, that they're sold as he received them, and his comments to you that they were sourced from the reconditioners...

                              Do reconditioners apply stickers? I thought they just verified safety and repainted the shells?
                              first of all, every college and nfl equipment manager i have ever spoken with has told me that team decals are a) purchased by the team and b) applied by the equipment manager, not the reconditioner.

                              second, i can't imagine that any nfl or college organization would freely allow their reconditioner to sell, distribute, trade or make available to the public their game used helmets that don't pass inspection. and, further, i can't imagine that any nfl or college organization would freely give their reconditioner permission to dress up any other helmets in the reconditioner's possession, using team colors and stock decals, for the purpose of selling them to the public as game issued or game used.

                              but, for the record, i decided to pose this question to circle systems group, a major reconditioner for college and pro teams and this is the response i received..


                              ----- Original Message -----
                              From: David Drill (davidd@circlesystemgroup.com)

                              Sent: Monday, August 27, 2007 8:58 AM
                              Subject: RE: RECONDITIONING QUESTION

                              We do not supply the decals when doing helmets for nfl teams. They apply them. Any helmet sent in is their property and we return all of them to the teams.

                              but, with that said, do rejected game used helmets ever make their way out of a reconditioning room and into the hands of the public? i'm sure it's happened before. is it policy? do reconditioners routinely and above board supply the gridirion authentics of the world with authentic "game issued" helmets of particular teams for the purpose of resale. i don't think so...
                              robert

                              Comment

                              • mvandor
                                Banned
                                • Apr 2007
                                • 1032

                                #30
                                Re: Radtke Sports, Gridiron Authentics...

                                aeneas, while we're on the GA subject, would you mind looking at pics of my Montana "game issue" helmet from GA? I actually bought it on ebay from the orig buyer, not GA directly, about a year ago. Unlike my other helmets, this one is rough inside and does have leather jaw pads, however, the numbering seems too clean inside, and given our recent discussions on GA, I'd be shocked if this actually was ever a team issued dome. In any event would appreciate your comments.



                                Rest of pics here: http://thevandors.com/montana

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