Greed in this hobby

[marino13]

Re: Greed in this hobby

I dont know if anyone has touch the "recycling's fund" subject on this matter, but you CANT spend your hard earned money on these collectibles without the help of "recycling's funds".

By recycling's funds I mean selling off stuff that you can make some profit and so forth. Even if selling at cost or a little lost, they are still consider as recycling your funds.

Unless you have unlimited budget, why bother with "flipping collectibles" for fun - this makes absolutely no sense unless you are doing it for the rush at the moment or just to pissed off those doing it for "the love of the hobby".

But then again, I can only speak for myself - I do purchase more than enough of the gamers - but I also sell more than my fair share of the stuff since I dont want to end up on HOARDERs TV or people will have fun finding my stuff in STORAGE WARS and so forth.

As for being LATE or MISSED a good deal - you snooze and you lose. There is NO other logical answer beside that. If a deal is too good to be true, then it is just that. But, there are some case of non-educated sellers/stores, I will have no problem paying for the minimal asking and turn around and make a quick profit off of it.

Bottom line, there is GREED everywhere. But for you to have GREED, you need to have FUNDS to back it up. You CANT talk about GREED without funds and when you do, it is just all ENVY and JEALOUSY in my book.

[abstractheory]

Re: Greed in this hobby

"The person that buys a bunch of jerseys and turns around and flips them, gives me a chance at buying something I want as long as I feel the price is fair. I'm not going to ask what he paid for it or how much of a profit he makes.[/QUOTE]

Exactly! Example: I recently bought some game used AF Falcons game used helmets on Ebay that were sold at an open auction I unfortunately missed for waaaaay less then what I ended up paying. I was upset that I missed the auction, but was glad they were available to me, no matter the inflated price. Knowing full well what the seller paid in the auction after a little research, and, knowing the amount of profit they made off my dumb-ass for missing it, I still left them positive feedback. Why? Because without them, I would have never been able to obtain them.

Like someone already said, this hobby IS a business and a very competitive one, at that.

I hear what the OP is saying about it being frustrating sometimes, but that also makes it even more rewarding.

[abstractheory]

For some reason, there seem to be people who think these basic economic realities should not apply to game used items. Personally, I am glad there are dealers out there, and auction houses, and ebay sellers.

Amen!! Since I don't have many inside contacts/connections, this is my only way to score great stuff the majority of the time. I would die and shrivel-up without all those "greedy" scalpers.

[frikativ54]

Re: Greed in this hobby

All the folks I know who have a few bucks earn it - they work 16 hour days, miss graduations, Little League and soccer games and some go to bed at 8:00 at night because they have to go to work at 04:00 hours. Others spend half their lives on an airplane away from their families.

Of course, luck has everything to do with it. The people who work sixteen hours a day can do it, because of fortuitous circumstances. There was the family who financed or at least helped pay for their education, the coworkers who mentored them, the role models who brought a sense of stability. From the time they were kids, many had the personal and financial supports to succeed.

But some people don't have that, and they are less likely to make it in the fiercely competitive world of American capitalism. Take the kid who lives in the inner cities, who sees his friends succumb to gang violence or drugs. While I'm not saying that he cannot get ahead, he has a host of challenges to worry about that the aforementioned individuals don't. He can't pay for the finest colleges and the tutors that the rich can afford. He may not even have up-to-date textbooks.

Mom and Dad may be in prison. His sister may have been killed, due to gun violence, and he may have ceaselessly been bullied. If he is fortunate enough to have a shot at college, the schools may not meet his demonstrated financial need. If he falls ill or becomes depressed, he may not have the insurance to get adequate help. None of us succeeds in a vacuum; there are a whole host of people and circumstances that worked to our benefit.

Luck? Luck are the folks who stay home and whine that they aren't getting their fair share.

Who in our society stays home and doesn't work? The people I know who stay at home do as such because they aren't physically or mentally capable of having a job. You seriously mean to imply that such individuals - the disabled, broadly speaking - are lucky?

[beaglegypsy003]

Re: Greed in this hobby

Collectors living in Hawaii don't have the same opportunities or access as folks on the continental U.S. So say the Dallas Cowboys have a blow out of game jerseys, unless I know someone in the area or I fly up there myself, I won't have a chance of buying something. The person that buys a bunch of jerseys and turns around and flips them, gives me a chance at buying something I want as long as I feel the price is fair. I'm not going to ask what he paid for it or how much of a profit he makes.

[commando]

Re: Greed in this hobby

The concept is very simple and about a dozen people have said it in different ways. An item that is being offered for sale will go to the highest bidder, period. That is "fair."

Simple, stress-free, live and let live attitude that's key to enjoying this hobby, which after all is supposed to be fun. If someone's out there gobbling stuff up, that's their business and that's the way it goes. No big deal. Nobody actually NEEDS any game-used item after all.

Very well said. I don't have tons of extra money laying around, so I flip items here and there to help pay the expenses of being the Houston Gamblers team historian (web hosting, shipping and materials when sending things to players, acquiring team memorabilia to archive, etc)...

I guess I'll mention three points here:

First, it is a slippery slope when you try to guess a seller's intentions, whether it be greed, making a living, or in my case, donating my earnings (and time) for a cause I think is important.

Secondly, "collectors" come and go, especially with the fad items. Most sports cards, comic books and stamps printed during the popular "fad" years can be purchased today for a fraction of what they cost at the peak of their popularity. As a matter of fact, I avidly collect oddball cards from the 1980s and continue to rake in several sets a week as I find them. The fact that this market crashed several years ago doesn't bother me in the least. I do have to wonder though.... What happened to all these card "collectors" and where are they today?

Finally, I agree with those who have said we need to get over the items we can't afford or think are too expensive. The example in my world would be the many Gamblers jerseys owned by Wayne Otto. These shirts were worn by the guys I work for and work with -- people who are true friends -- but I cannot and will not pay over $500 for a common player jersey. I have purchased things from Wayne in the past, and he's a great guy, but at this point in time I won't lose any sleep over jerseys I feel are overpriced. My latest purchase was a couple of months ago, when I snagged a couple of beautiful Gamblers jerseys from Mark Hayne. His prices were more than reasonable, and now the search continues......

I respect everyone's opinion here, and I can understand why people feel the way they feel. I'll bet we have ALL been frustrated at one time or another with someone's selling practices. When this happens to me I choose to either shake my head sadly, or point and laugh, then continue on with the search for the next interesting item. Seek and ye shall find, my GU brothers and sisters.

[hairyangryfella]

Re: Greed in this hobby

You mentioned you've sold some of your things in the past. Did you sell to the highest offer, or to the fourth-highest offer?

Well I think any GU item I've ever sold was for a loss, so your point is again irrelevant.

I don't dislike people for having money and buying an item they want.
I do dislike people not giving collectors a chance to buy something they want at a fair price (or at all like stageleft/jt) because their sole intention is to relist at a much higher price. That's what I'm getting at here.

Yes, there is always a business aspect to things, and always a $ amount you can put on something. But is it now accepted for someone to just sweep in and take everything so that they can hold it hostage for profit? Is that capitalism, or is that greed?

[jbean023]

Re: Greed in this hobby

I knew this would turn into a cut throat thread and would have both sides that strongly disagree. My opinion on the topic looks at this thread a few different ways.

One I thought this is like us all having a conversation about women(no offense to the women on here) so ill comment for both sides. Everyone one wants a Jennifer Aniston or for ladies everyone wants a Channing Tatum but that's not how the cookie crumbles.

You know what makes me mad, when people buy gas and resell that for higher prices, I want gas straight from the source for the cheapest possible amount!!! Can anyone help me? Ken?? Could you buy us GUU members an oil well?

The thing that gets to me the most, Ive talked through email with a few of you on this topic is the fact that all the American game used items are crossing the ocean and those folks are happy to pay our prices. No offense to you oversea seas collectors because I have done many deals with you but I'll give you an example(its not that the item is going to an overseas collector). I had a pair Jose Bautista signed GU Reebok zig zag cleats on Ebay for $800 OBO. I have never seen a pair for sale so wasn't sure on the value, to me "PE" baseball cleats are more rare than bats and jerseys. I got 300$,400$,450$ offers from US collectors after the first day. I wanted the auction to run 2 weeks and see what offers I got, well when I declined the offer I would get nasty messages saying "Those cleats aren't worth that much" and saying a bunch of negative thoughts(being rude and very disrespectful). To me a pair of cleats might be worth 1,000$ and to you the cleats might be worth 5$, but if you want the cleats from me you're going to pay 1,000$ or I'll keep them in my collection. Then I had a gentleman message me and ask if I would ship overseas, very polite and respectful message. Needless to say the cleats went to a Japanese collector and he said he would of gladly paid 1200$ if I would of asked as he has never seen a pair.

All in all if any of us walked up to a garage sale and seen an old Ty Cobb bat sitting there for 1$, could be a kids play bat, could be Ty's bat. You buy the bat, have the bat checked out and sure enough that's a Ty Cobb game used bat. I contact you and say hey Im a huge Ty Cobb collector would you please sell me that bat for 1$ since that's what you paid. No one on here would say yes, that bat is going to auction or staying in your collection.

Below is two definitions of greed, by definition anyone that has excess of material items is greed, so that would make us all greedy!

As defined outside of Christian writings, greed is an inordinate desire to acquire or possess more than one needs, especially with respect to material wealth.

However, greed (as seen by the church) is applied to a very excessive or rapacious desire and pursuit of material possessions.

[Mark17]

Re: Greed in this hobby

No, that's not what I'm saying.
Why can't you guys understand that this isn't about ME? I'm not in a position to buy stuff at the moment anyway. It's about what is happening with the 'hobby' becoming 'a business' and the behaviour of people.

But you can continue being ignorant if you want......

The concept is very simple and about a dozen people have said it in different ways. An item that is being offered for sale will go to the highest bidder, period. That is "fair."

Buying and selling for a profit is how the private sector in this country thrives, whether it's your local gas station, Walmart, or a guy trying to make some extra cash flipping game used stuff.

I remember many years ago, Bruce and Floyd Hartel bought a bunch of Twins jerseys and re-sold them, for a profit I assume. This allowed me to pick up a couple jerseys I wanted. Before and since, I've bought all sorts of items from many dealers and ebay sellers, and presumably, every single one of them had the goal of making money.

People who flip game used to make a profit are not "greedy," any more than the guy who sells cars or houses, or an employee who looks forward to getting a bonus or raise. Or anyone who buys a lottery ticket for that matter. Everybody I know would like some extra cash, and the more the better. It's human nature and basic common sense.

You mentioned you've sold some of your things in the past. Did you sell to the highest offer, or to the fourth-highest offer?

For some reason, there seem to be people who think these basic economic realities should not apply to game used items. Personally, I am glad there are dealers out there, and auction houses, and ebay sellers.

If you think I'm ignorant I can't help that. I learned a long time ago that there are all sorts of things I can't afford, so I live without them and don't worry about it. I'll go after common players while the guys with the dough go after the really great stuff. And when I miss out on something, I shrug my shoulders and hope for better luck next time.

Simple, stress-free, live and let live attitude that's key to enjoying this hobby, which after all is supposed to be fun. If someone's out there gobbling stuff up, that's their business and that's the way it goes. No big deal. Nobody actually NEEDS any game-used item after all.

[CPuente57]

Re: Greed in this hobby

For me personally, it's not that I feel entitled to get stuff cheap because I'm a collector, the only frustration I have is knowing you have no shot at the opportunity at a lot of the NBA Stuff. The finals jerseys for example, the guy that won (and JTNBAFan) seemed like he had no limit on what he was willing to spend. For example the Jarvis Vernado Game Issued Jersey for 2 grand, he would've kept building that up until he won period. Again, there's nothing wrong with it, if I had all the money in the world, I'd love to be able to compete like that, but for me it's like why even bother when you know who's gonna win everything?

[woodward30]

Re: Greed in this hobby

No, that's not what I'm saying.
Why can't you guys understand that this isn't about ME? I'm not in a position to buy stuff at the moment anyway. It's about what is happening with the 'hobby' becoming 'a business' and the behaviour of people.

But you can continue being ignorant if you want......

You're using the word "hobby" rather loosely. This isn't fishing where you have the freedom to drive down to the lake and throw your pole in whenever you wish. Game used memorabilia is a business. It's a competitive market characterized by supply and demand. Dealers and re-sellers assume risk when buying an item with the hope of selling it to make a profit. The item is owned by the dealer and thus they have every right to list an item at whatever price they wish and also have the right to try to sell it at their desired price for however long they wish. This is the basic principles of capitalism.

[hairyangryfella]

Re: Greed in this hobby

What you're saying is that you wish you could buy things at a price lower than what someone else was willing to pay. I guess all of us would like that arrangement from time to time, but I think most people realize that's not how it works.

I can just see an auction house telling a consigner: "Yeah, we could've sold your jersey for $5,000, but there's this collector who really, really wanted it for his collection, so we let him have it for $2500. We felt since he was a collector, he shouldn't have to bid competitively against the guy who is just a greedy dealer."

No, that's not what I'm saying.
Why can't you guys understand that this isn't about ME? I'm not in a position to buy stuff at the moment anyway. It's about what is happening with the 'hobby' becoming 'a business' and the behaviour of people.

[Mark17]

Re: Greed in this hobby

The thing that really bothers me is when some one tries to sell something on Ebay for a high price say $800 for a common player MLB jersey and it does not sell and they keep listing it for $800 3, 4, 5 times in a row. You would think that after the 1st few times an item was listed you drop the price to get it sold. If it did not sell at a starting bid of $800 what makes you think the 5th time you list it at $800 it will be any different. Why would a buyer be inclined to bid on an item that went unsold 5 times in a row at the same high price. This is what really bothers me.

Why does it bother you? Why does it even matter to you?

[BamaHater]

Re: Greed in this hobby

The thing that really bothers me is when some one tries to sell something on Ebay for a high price say $800 for a common player MLB jersey and it does not sell and they keep listing it for $800 3, 4, 5 times in a row. You would think that after the 1st few times an item was listed you drop the price to get it sold. If it did not sell at a starting bid of $800 what makes you think the 5th time you list it at $800 it will be any different. Why would a buyer be inclined to bid on an item that went unsold 5 times in a row at the same high price. This is what really bothers me.

[Mark17]

Re: Greed in this hobby

Who exactly is doing that?

I have a full time job. I save up and buy what I can afford. I've even had to sell off some of my cherished items to fund things I have to pay for. I don't "stay home and whine". I just don't like seeing people taking advantage - I know people who wanted certain items but to then see one person buy them all up to list for much higher prices (is happening on NBA auctions a little too) is worrying me, because this kind of behaviour ruins hobbies. It becomes a business, rather than a hobby and it becomes all about profit, rather than people having a chance to buy something they would treasure.

What you're saying is that you wish you could buy things at a price lower than what someone else was willing to pay. I guess all of us would like that arrangement from time to time, but I think most people realize that's not how it works.

I can just see an auction house telling a consigner: "Yeah, we could've sold your jersey for $5,000, but there's this collector who really, really wanted it for his collection, so we let him have it for $2500. We felt since he was a collector, he shouldn't have to bid competitively against the guy who is just a greedy dealer."