GFC: 1984 Michael Jordan's "first" jersey

[otismalibu]

Re: GFC: 1984 Michael Jordan's "first" jersey

[kingjammy24]

Re: GFC: 1984 Michael Jordan's "first" jersey

[insert: newspaper article i failed to find]

"I didn't think anyone was capable of finding what Greg Faragher has found," marveled Celtics ace Larry Bird. "He is the most exciting, awesome poster on GUU today. I think it's just God disguised as Greg Faragher."

rudy.

[otismalibu]

Re: GFC: 1984 Michael Jordan's "first" jersey

[kingjammy24]

Re: GFC: 1984 Michael Jordan's "first" jersey

I'll take Less Value for $200, Alex.

yes but by how much? how much less for a preseason only than for a preseason AND regular season? personally, i think at least 40% less. assuming that both would be his "first issued" jersey (whatever that means). saying that in one scenario this shirt was used only in the preseason and in another scenario it was used in the preseason AND regular season. i'm thinking 40-50% price difference between the two.

If I was researching this item, I'd first be looking for the Bulls pre-season schedule that season. Then make a list of the road cities and start doing newspaper research. You can find some poor quality page scans online for free.

come on man. i'm no amateur. tried it, tried it, tried it. zip, zilch. i can't even find any 2-word mention anywhere of the bulls 1984-85 preseason except the SI and nba.com blurbs about him wearing air jordans in the preseason.

the other thing i am interested in is how late in the season did jordan wear the generic white nikes ("air ships")? can't find anything on that either. i did find him wearing them as late as dec 4. meaning he wore the generic white nikes after already wearing the air jordans. i think if you find him wearing air jordans it doesn't necessarily mean its late in the season and if you find him wearing the "air ships" it doesn't necessarily mean it's "very early" in the season as GFC implies.

rudy.

[otismalibu]

Re: GFC: 1984 Michael Jordan's "first" jersey

what would be the difference in value if the shirt had only been used in the preseason vs if it had been used in the preseason AND the regular season?

I'll take Less Value for $200, Alex.

Off the top of my head, I'd probably rank NBA jerseys as:
1) reg.season/playoff jersey
2) AS game jersey
3) pre-season jersey

If I was researching this item, I'd first be looking for the Bulls pre-season schedule that season. Then make a list of the road cities and start doing newspaper research. You can find some poor quality page scans online for free. You can also buy prints from newspapers. I've done it more than once. Rare photos delivered to your door.

[rareair23.com]

Re: GFC: 1984 Michael Jordan's "first" jersey

Let me restate what I just said earlier...for the first several games, (I have it at home somewhere documenting oct/nov. when he was wearing the Nike Air Ships...which is a style like the Air Forces etc... those are what you see during the first few games...white/white air ships/ white red air ships...now I have one rare image of MJ wearing that specific jersey and the black/red AIR ships... the prototype red/black/white AJ Is ...were from part of Nov on...and for a few games I think he switched back and forth..from AJ I to Ships etc... Mike can clarify it..I have the info at home somewhere when I was doing the research at the time..

[kingjammy24]

Re: GFC: 1984 Michael Jordan's "first" jersey

I have an image of Jordan wearing the Black Red Air Ships wearing that specific jersey with that style numeral font....if I recall correctly it must have been preseason, but don't quote me on that till I research it further...

can you post this image? GFC is dating the jersey, in large part, to the generic white nikes which they say jordan "only wore early in his rookie year". if jordan was wearing air jordans in the preseason then GFC's theory goes out the window. here's jordan wearing air jordans as of nov 17 which would be pretty early in the season:



initially, i thought it was GFC who found that pic of jordan wearing the odd font. i now realize that sothebys had it a year earlier so i take back my kudos to GFC for the pic. it seems like GFC's done an appalling lack of investigative work on what is one of the most notable jerseys to surface in many years. this isn't some $50 rag. they haven't discerned the previous nob, they haven't figured out whether it was used strictly in the preseason or whether it saw regular season action, they haven't discussed why the jersey has a font that was used years before jordan's arrival, have called it jordan's "first jersey" but haven't disclosed that in jordan's first road game he's wearing a different shirt, and haven't even specified what they mean by "first jersey issued" or how they can claim that their jersey was issued before any and all others. their theory of his white nikes shoes conclusively dating the jersey to early in his rookie season is nullified if darren posts a pic of jordan wearing air jordans in the preseason. $50k-$100k shirt and they're under the impression that it's amateur hour.

warren, greg, reid fontaine and other nba collectors, i'm curious about the potential value here. what would be the difference in value if the shirt had only been used in the preseason vs if it had been used in the preseason AND the regular season?

rudy.

[rareair23.com]

Re: GFC: 1984 Michael Jordan's "first" jersey

The time frame has already been established. Knee braces and shoes help pinpoint this time frame.

BTW...the photo you posted in from the '87 Dunk Contest. The low-cut Jordan II's pinpoint the time frame.

I agree, the shoes...and the team in the background pinpoints a specific timeline..

[rareair23.com]

Re: GFC: 1984 Michael Jordan's "first" jersey

I have an image of Jordan wearing the Black Red Air Ships wearing that specific jersey with that style numeral font....if I recall correctly it must have been preseason, but don't quote me on that till I research it further...the Banned Black/Red Air Jordan 1 marketing thing was made up by Nike...to this very day I cannot actually confirm Jordan ever wearing the Black/Red 1s in a reg. season game...other then during the Slam Dunk contest at Indianapolis 1985....this is were I need to brainstorm with Mike, since he's the expert on Jordan sneakerology..

[rareair23.com]

Re: GFC: 1984 Michael Jordan's "first" jersey

I would say that's a pretty early rookie jersey if you ask me.....could be preseason.

[otismalibu]

Re: GFC: 1984 Michael Jordan's "first" jersey

you'd think GFC's pic and beantown's pic indicate that jordan wore the incorrect jersey for at least 2 different games given the no brace/brace issue. however its possible that they're from the same game and jordan just put a brace on during the second half.

Tough to tell w/o any pics of the other team, court, etc. Has the left sweat band on in each. There's gotta be another pic online somewhere that gives a little more info.

I'm sure you could see a lot more of the original name, if you could get your hands on the jersey.

[kingjammy24]

Re: GFC: 1984 Michael Jordan's "first" jersey

Knee braces and shoes help pinpoint this time frame.

yes. upon seeing the GFC pic without the knee brace, my first thought was that perhaps jordan first began wearing a knee brace at a specific point in his rookie season. if you could over the games from 84-85, maybe you could see roughly at what point he began wearing it and then date jersey that way. however, he was wearing it at UNC and in his NBA debut. noticeably he didn't wear the brace in the 85 ASG/dunk contest. didn't think he'd need it? wouldn't be playing for very long? in the GFC pic, was he also playing in some sort of game where he didn't think he'd need it? wouldn't be playing long? like in some sort of exhibition game where they try to give everyone a bit of playing time? in his rookie season, jordan was playing full time. 82 games averaging 38.3 minutes a game. thats pretty much playing all 4 quarters. or maybe it's as simple as him simply not having one on hand. i don't know but it is interesting that the GFC pic shows him without a knee brace which is a rare thing. you'd think GFC's pic and beantown's pic indicate that jordan wore the incorrect jersey for at least 2 different games given the no brace/brace issue. however its possible that they're from the same game and jordan just put a brace on during the second half.

one look at the previous pic of him dunking and you can immediately tell it's not from 84/85 because of the shoes, which didn't exist in 84/85. he had the air jordan I's as of the start of the 84/85 season but first wore them nov 17 which is pretty early in the season. contrary to GFC's claim that he began wearing them later in the season. and from what i can tell, it wasn't like he wore his white/white, white/red nikes in the first part and then exclusively switched to the air jordan I's in the latter part. he seemed to mix it up thoughout the season. he was being fined $5k per game each time he wore the air jordans. what i'd like to know is how late in the season he wore the nikes. was he wearing them in march?

as for the name/number change, i've tried very hard to discern the name. i cannot. sitting here at my computer, there's nothing more i can do with the name/number change issue. it's a dead end. noone who wore #35 in previous seasons had a last name starting with "W".

1980-81 - larry kenon #35 - 6'9", 205
1981-82 - larry kenon #35 - 6'9", 205
1982-83 - larry kenon #35 - 6'9", 205
1982-83 - larry spriggs #35 - 6'7", 230
1983-84 - noone
1984-85 - noone

i do find it hard to believe that with the jersey in hand, GFC cannot discern the name either. the previous name might help a lot.

the big question that all of this is seeking to answer is did jordan ever wear the incorrect jersey in the regular season or is it strictly a preseason-only jersey. i think that issue has a big effect on the value both in a monetary sense and a collectible sense.

maybe darren/rareair23 can be of assistance.

rudy.

[both-teams-played-hard]

Re: GFC: 1984 Michael Jordan's "first" jersey

The Jordan in GFC pics clearly has a name/number change on the back. Why not try and research this rather than focus on knee braces & shoes?

You guys are onto some GREAT ideas but I think this trait is a more deceive factor in pinpointing the specific time frame this jersey is from. If one can only locate a good pic showing this characteristic....

The time frame has already been established. Knee braces and shoes help pinpoint this time frame.

BTW...the photo you posted in from the '87 Dunk Contest. The low-cut Jordan II's pinpoint the time frame.

[TriplexXxSports]

Re: GFC: 1984 Michael Jordan's "first" jersey

Incorrect font. That's not it, my bad.

Does anyone have a copy of the movie 'Michael Jordan's Playground'? If I remember correctly there are some of his rookie highlights in there. Could be a source

[TriplexXxSports]

Re: GFC: 1984 Michael Jordan's "first" jersey

The pic would help....